Industry and Technology Committee on Nov. 3rd, 2025

[Philip Jennings]

We're used to things occasionally not going as planned during contract negotiations. Specific clauses are designed to resolve misunderstandings during the contract period.

As soon as we learned that Stellantis made a decision, the minister decided to call the Canadian CEO of Stellantis to ask him to come to Ottawa. Unifor officials were also invited, as well as the minister's counterpart from Ontario. The meeting took place to help us understand the decision and then find a solution as quickly as possible. The most obvious solution, but perhaps the most difficult, would be to reverse the decision. Otherwise, the Brampton plant would need another mandate, specifically to save as many jobs as possible.

The contract contains specific clauses that provide for a quick resolution. Otherwise, ultimately, a clause states that a penalty will be imposed on the company in the event of a breach of contract. In our opinion, as the minister said, a failure to find a solution quickly enough will result in the termination of the contract.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you for this comprehensive response.

Should we make changes to how we draft and add clauses to future contracts with major players such as Stellantis, major employers that are often multinationals, or would you say that we can't achieve a better result than the contract already signed and that everything is already included?

[Philip Jennings]

I would say that it's a bit like a dance between two partners. The federal government tries to attract investment and the companies seek to maximize their profits, eliminate as much risk as possible and get the most out of Canada and Ontario.

It's always possible to obtain a better contract. However, the other party may have a different opinion on what constitutes a better contract. We really need to establish a reasonable deal that will lead to investment in Canada. That's the goal. We're trying to maximize the benefits for Canada, but our main goal is to attract investment.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

As a general rule, when drafting these types of contracts, do you include provisions regarding potential economic fluctuations, such as the possibility of a recession? Are these types of clauses found in contracts?

[Philip Jennings]

This type of clause may exist. Each contract is different and may be flexible enough to include these types of fluctuations in certain clauses. For example, we may agree on an average number of jobs over three years. This number may then decrease or increase from year to year. There are various ways to take these fluctuations into account in different contracts.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Is this type of aspect included in the agreements with Stellantis concerning the Brampton plant?

[Philip Jennings]

One aspect concerns the number of jobs in the contracts. As the minister said, we want to share as much of them as possible with you. Discussions are already under way with Stellantis to get their perspective on sharing the contracts. However, the goal is to share as much information as possible and to redact as little as possible so that we all have the same overview.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you.

I was stunned by the minister's response earlier. When the people from Stellantis came to the committee, they said that the Jeep Compass would no longer be assembled in Brampton, but that something else would be produced there.

The Unifor officials actually told us that they heard the news 15 minutes before the official announcement. Ms. Joly just told us today that the people from Stellantis haven't made any proposals yet regarding their plans for the Brampton plant. However, when we heard them speak, we were certain that they already had a solid plan.

Can you talk again about your deadlines? The minister spoke about a 30‑day deadline. Do you think that this is sufficient and that Stellantis will propose a plan for the Brampton plant?

[Philip Jennings]

The minister certainly wants to resolve this as soon as possible. I haven't seen her letter. However, the contract states that the company has 30 days to propose a plan. In my opinion, the people from Stellantis will find it challenging to implement a specific mandate within 30 days, but we expect them to do so. They must have had internal discussions before making the decision to move the Jeep Compass production. They may already have an idea of the mandate for the Brampton plant. We'll see. For now, I don't have any more information for the committee.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Thank you, Mr. Ste‑Marie.

Ms. Dancho, you have the floor.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Thank you.

Thanks to all of you for being here. I appreciate your responses thus far.

I want to dig into a bit of what I was asking the minister about. I did find interesting what she did reveal. She said that the letter was sent today, and again, I'm assuming that's under the dispute resolution process regarding the Brampton SIF agreement. That's my understanding. Can you confirm that?

[Philip Jennings]

I'm sorry, Chair. I'll just say that I actually haven't seen the letter the minister has sent or will send. I can't confirm what's in the letter.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Has anyone been privy to that letter, or are the minister and her staff just sort of acting on their own?

[Philip Jennings]

We've given advice, but I have not seen the letter that she has sent.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Okay, but you would know which agreement it's about—would you not?

[Philip Jennings]

I'm sorry. Just to be clear, yes, I have seen the agreement that Stellantis may be breaching if there is no different mandate put into Brampton.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

You can confirm that it's the SIF money for the Brampton-Windsor retooling. Is that correct?

[Philip Jennings]

I can't confirm the details of the contract until we've cleared it with the company what I can share through the contract.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Right. She did say that, though, at the end of her testimony. She was alluding to the letter being sent and that it was the Brampton SIF agreement. I'm just paraphrasing what she said, but that was my take-away. Again, that's because I was asking her about the publicly available contracts for the other SIF agreement for NextStar and the special contribution agreement for NextStar, but she specifically said the Brampton SIF agreement, I believe.

I'm just asking that because she mentioned that they were all linked together, and I do believe that I understand which clause in this contract links them. You can't confirm for sure that's what she said? I mean, she did say it.

[Philip Jennings]

What I can confirm, which is in the public domain, is that there's a SIF agreement that actually covers Windsor and Brampton, and—

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Right. Thank you.

[Philip Jennings]

—in that agreement there would be job commitments and capex investments and so forth as a standard for contracts.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

On the job commitments, what were the job commitments?

[Philip Jennings]

That, I'm unfortunately not at liberty to share at this moment. As I said, we've already launched and asked Stellantis to see what we can share with this committee. In the past considerations of this committee, we found solutions to be able to share quite a bit in terms of what is in those contracts.