Evidence of meeting #8 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 39th Parliament, 2nd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was countries.
A recording is available from Parliament.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
Right; there is. But there would also be room attendants, housekeeping, that kind of thing.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Tourism Industry Association of Canada
That's right, and maintenance and so on.
I would like our industry compared with similar industries, rather than against the national average. I would suggest that then we would fare a lot more reasonably. But when you're comparing us with all other sectors, it becomes a bit of a challenge.
I've worked in our industry since I was 15 and a busboy. It provided me, while I was going to school, with great income. I wouldn't even worry—you've heard stories of this—about my paycheque; my paycheque was secondary. I always had cash in my pocket. I'm sure some of the members can recall their days when they were working in our industry.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
But I hear from people who work in this sector, and in Mr. Pollard's sector as well, who are adults, who are supporting families, and who are making very low incomes in this sector. I raise this because obviously, with more investment in new technology, while there will always be a labour component, there is automation of labour. Whether or not better wages would help reduce the labour shortage problem, it would certainly improve people's quality of life; I know that for sure.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Tourism Industry Association of Canada
I agree that we have some challenges in this area, and we are looking at ways to improve our productivity as an industry. I believe we all have a share of this responsibility. When you look at a company—and I won't name the brand—that has hotels on both sides of the border, for example, and when you talk to the CEOs of these companies, their profitability has less potential in Canada than in the United States because of the tax and structural costs they have, beyond their control, in Canada that they don't have in the United States.
If we didn't have these property tax and other costs that we have within our properties and businesses, then maybe we could also look at the wage, which is about 30% to 40% of a business's cost in tourism. We could increase those wages with less taxation.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Tourism Industry Association of Canada
We could increase those wages with less taxation.
Conservative
Liberal
Raymond Simard Liberal Saint Boniface, MB
Thank you very much.
Mr. Pollard, I'd like to continue on the skilled labour shortages issue. It's certainly not unique to your industry. I know, for instance, that in Manitoba a lot of the construction companies are aggressively recruiting in Europe right now. They're going to Italy, France, and Belgium and recruiting people. My brother just came back from there on one of those missions.
I'd like to know if your industry is doing something similar, if you're aggressively going out there.
President, Hotel Association of Canada
Very much so. If you look at it from the point of view of when is a hotel in the high season, typically it's April through to November. And the low season? It starts falling off during the winter period. If you look at the Caribbean region or Asia, it's the flip. So you logically say, well, you fish where the fish are.
I went out to several of the embassies—we're fortunate, we're based here in Ottawa—and developed a very close relationship with the people from El Salvador, Dominican Republic, Barbados, and the Philippines. What we did was provide those countries with the proper training for individuals—and typically, you're looking at housekeepers.
Through the Canadian Tourism Human Resource Council, we have all the training materials. We provided these countries with those materials. We then asked how many people they had ready, willing, and able immediately. The people from El Salvador were fabulous in this regard.
You mentioned Manitoba. Maple Leaf Foods has over 700 people from that country up there, and over the last three years with them, there has only been one incident where somebody had to go home. So the success rate is very good.
So not only are we asking the federal government to help us in this area, but we're expediting the process by saying okay, here are the people who are trained and ready to come up here. And our industry will pay the airfare to bring them up. That's not the issue.
Liberal
Liberal
Raymond Simard Liberal Saint Boniface, MB
It's hugely successful in Manitoba. I know it exists elsewhere, but I'm not sure if it's as successful. It seems to me that's the kind of thing we should be encouraging.
Liberal
Raymond Simard Liberal Saint Boniface, MB
The Province of Manitoba created just lately a French Manitoba trade, if you will, and they have people recruiting in French countries around the world, very successfully. Our governments have to be innovative in what they do as well.
President, Hotel Association of Canada
I think, at the end of the day, the temporary foreign worker program was created out of something within the department. In my opening statement I said it needs to be created as a separate line item within the budget of HRSDC. In other words, it's there; it's happening. This problem, as we've all said, is not going away and we need to move forward.
In terms of provincial nomination, that one is a little bit of a conundrum for us, because the citizenship and immigration rules are such that you want to make sure that the person goes home after their year or two years. The provincial nominee program does the opposite. It wants to make them feel so good that they become permanent Canadian citizens. But I do believe the federal government is working with the provincial bodies in that regard.
Liberal
Raymond Simard Liberal Saint Boniface, MB
Mr. Williams, we just briefly mentioned the 2010 Olympics. What is the industry doing in terms of the Olympics to ensure that the economic spinoffs go beyond the B.C. boundaries?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Tourism Industry Association of Canada
That's a great question. TIAC has led a coalition, actually, over the last three years or so, looking at ways to take the benefits of hosting the games beyond the 17 days of games in themselves, and also outside of the B.C. border.
The Sydney Olympics were seen as the best games for tourism, leaving the best legacy for tourism. So we've engaged Frank King, who was leading the Calgary Olympics, to speak to us.
We've met with the people from Australia and talked to them about what they did well there and what they learned, and that information has been shared with the Canadian Tourism Commission, with Industry Canada and with Heritage Canada, which are working in intergovernmental departments, and also with VANOC, and so on.
There are a number of activities at all kinds of levels that are under way now to ensure that the Olympic Games provide a lasting legacy for Canada beyond B.C., and also beyond the 17 days of games themselves. The $5 million—or $26 million—itself shows you that there's a recognition that it's not just for 2010. It's $5 million over five years, before and after the games. So even that statement in itself recognizes the pre-benefits and post-benefits of the games.
Conservative
Conservative
Bruce Stanton Conservative Simcoe North, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I have a couple of follow-up questions if I could.
One of the things that we were perhaps missing in terms of looking at the size and scope of the industry was some points of comparison. We all recognize this is a problem, and I'm glad you mentioned the diversity side of it. I assume GDP would be the best measure of this. Where does the tourism industry stack up against, for example, agriculture or forestry? Do you have those numbers?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Tourism Industry Association of Canada
We're 2.3% of the Canadian GDP. If you take the three industries—forestry, agriculture, and I forget the third one--and combine them, they still wouldn't be the size of tourism. So we are a major industry, and obviously one that needs to be accounted for.
Can I add a comment? I just don't want this to be missing.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Tourism Industry Association of Canada
In regard to your comment about innovative solutions related to the workforce and your comment on the workforce of what should be done, I'll give you an example of innovation that I think Canada needs to look at more.
If you look at New Zealand right now, they're promoting their country and at the same time promoting their country to work in for young people. So what they're doing, during their peak season, is offering young people when they're out of school to come and stay in their country, get a work visa and explore at the same time. What they're providing in their advertising to come to New Zealand is they're saying come and work in New Zealand and explore at the same time.
That's the kind of innovation that I think can help our country. So if we're looking at Canada during the Olympics, or Canada during our summer period, why don't we include in our advertising the message: we will expedite a work visa for you if you come and commit to stay here for 120 days or 90 days. We will give you a work visa and help you to also visit and give you some time off. So we get a worker who will work for maybe 60 or 75 days, and also get a two-week stay here and share our culture. I think that would be an example. That's something New Zealand is doing.
Conservative
Bruce Stanton Conservative Simcoe North, ON
I appreciate that, but I have limited time here, and I want to try to catch up. There are just a couple of other follow-up items.
Tony, in regard to the business travel sector—I think the point was raised earlier—do you have any proportion as to what that represents? That really is a service that you're providing to other industries, in point of fact. Where does that shake out in terms of the percentage—
President, Hotel Association of Canada
First of all, 60% of the use of our hotels in Canada is business travel, which is higher than in the U.S., simply because there are more things there, like Disneyland, Disney World, Vegas, etc., which typically are promoted to the leisure traveller.
When this committee travels to hearings in Vancouver, you aren't going to Vancouver because you necessarily want to go out and go to the aquarium at Stanley Park; you're going there because it's your job to go there. So when we're looking at a lot of the various elements today that Randy and I are discussing, we're really focusing more on the leisure traveller, how to be able to get those people there. There is a side effect to it. If you go to Vancouver, you've never been there before and you're there on a trip on business, and you say this is a really neat place, I'm going to bring the family back, obviously there's a benefit that accrues in that area.
