Evidence of meeting #23 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was vote.
A recording is available from Parliament.
3:30 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Dan Ruimy
I call the meeting to order.
Welcome to the 23rd meeting of the Standing Committee on Industry, Science and Technology.
We're going to get right into it today. We have witnesses for the first hour, and in the second hour we're in camera with the analysts, going through where we are to date on our manufacturing study. We have an hour.
Go ahead, Mr. Lobb.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON
Thank you for giving me the floor, Mr. Chair.
I introduced my motion last week and I was hoping we could have the discussion in public to debate it. That discussion is to suspend this manufacturing sector study and commence a study of the independence of Stats Canada.
I think this study is a fantastic study and we've had great discussion, but in light of the fact that Mr. Smith has resigned from Stats Canada for some very compelling reasons, I think it's prudent for this committee, in the spirit of transparency, to briefly discuss this motion at this time and have a vote in public on this study and this motion so we can see what's going on at Stats Canada and Shared Services and have Mr. Smith elaborate further on what he sees as the issues and on why the crash occurred almost minutes after the labour report was tabled by Stats Canada. This a huge issue.
Hopefully all members feel that in the spirit of transparency—we hear in question period all the time that all members want to be transparent—we can show Canadians that we want to hear about this in the spirit of science.
3:30 p.m.
Liberal
Lloyd Longfield Liberal Guelph, ON
Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thanks, Mr. Lobb, for the comments, but this committee decided in its early meetings that we were going to do future business in camera and that we'd discuss agenda items in camera. If we were going to discuss this issue, I'd say we move in camera. We have witnesses who have travelled a good distance to talk to us, and I'd like to hear from the witnesses.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
Alex Nuttall Conservative Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON
Thank you.
I certainly appreciate that future business is dealt with in camera. However, since the motion discusses the current study that's on the floor, it therefore would appear to be able to be debated at the moment.
Also, I think that it's a fair point. We have set an agenda, quite frankly, but I don't think we can be so rigid as to say that if issues arise, we can't deal with those issues. Certainly I think this is one that's arisen—I don't want to repeat what Mr. Lobb said just now—and it has had national media attention. The media have started to discuss some of the concerns.
This organization, Stats Canada, has presented before this committee. This individual has been before this committee. What changed between the time he gave testimony to this committee about the future of Stats Canada and now? If there is an appearance that Stats Canada is no longer independent, that is a very worrisome piece of information. I think that taking a look, going through this, finding out what the facts are, and having the testimony come forward is a good thing.
I believe we agreed earlier that there could be four or eight more meetings on this study. I don't think we came to an exact number previously. The point is that it could be a month or two before the study is complete. Having this testimony can certainly help us provide the government with good advice on where they should move forward, recognizing that these issues have arisen not just with the current government. Some of these decisions were also made previously, so it isn't a partisan question.
3:35 p.m.
Conservative
Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON
To be honest, that's really all the time we need to take on this issue. I think Mr. Nuttall and I have said all we have to say on it. The vote's going to take about 25 seconds, and then our witnesses can get started.
We'd be ready to go here in about 30 seconds.
If the Liberals are ready to vote, we're ready to vote. If you want to vote it down, go right ahead, but do it in public.
3:35 p.m.
Liberal
Frank Baylis Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
It's obviously an important question. I move to have this looked at in camera in committee, as we've already agreed upon. I would like that voted on first.
3:35 p.m.
Liberal
Frank Baylis Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
I'm asking for a motion to adjourn this and have it discussed as we put aside a special committee to look at new business. They've raised an important point, and I think we should look at it in detail, but we don't have time now because of our guests, so I move that we adjourn the discussion and deal with it in camera.
3:35 p.m.
Liberal
Frank Baylis Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
I thought that the minute I made my motion to adjourn, it was non-debatable—correct me if I'm wrong—and we have to vote on that right now.
3:35 p.m.
The Clerk of the Committee Mr. Michael MacPherson
Because of the conditions attached to the motion, it would be debatable.
3:35 p.m.
Liberal
Frank Baylis Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
Then I remove the conditions. I just move that we adjourn the debate.
3:35 p.m.
A voice
No, he said “adjourn debate”.
3:35 p.m.
Conservative
Alex Nuttall Conservative Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON
If we just proceed with the debate, either on going in camera or voting on the issue, then we can move on with—
3:35 p.m.
Liberal
Frank Baylis Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
I don't want to debate it. A dilatory motion is non-debatable, and you have to vote right away.
3:35 p.m.
Conservative
Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON
Your motion was not a dilatory motion. Your motion is out of order.
3:35 p.m.
Conservative