Industry Committee on April 13th, 2017

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Thank you very much.

We're going to move to you, Mr. Jowhari. You have four minutes, if you can....

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

I want to make sure that Mr. Masse gets the last two.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Welcome to the committee, Minister and Mr. Knubley.

I want to acknowledge the staff behind you, Minister. They've done a great job of giving us the information we need to make sure that the questions we bring to the committee and to you are very focused.

I want to go back to the independence, specifically on the statistical method. So far, we've talked about the what and we've talked about the how. You've been very clear during your speech that the what is going to come from the government, through you, and that the how is going to be determined by what I call the “statistical method”, by the chief statistician. However, Bill C-36 leaves open the possibility of the chief statistician being overruled on methodological issues by the responsible minister, i.e., you.

What I would like to ask is, what circumstances would necessitate something like that? What is the process that's in place to make sure it brings the transparency that's needed to ensure everyone is aware when such things happen?

Thank you.

[Navdeep Bains, Liberal, Mississauga—Malton, ON]

Again, that's a very good question. Clearly, this is the issue that prompted the 2011 discussion as well. The reason we have that provision is that the minister is ultimately accountable for the Statistics Act. Obviously, if there's an intrusion or some sort of change made to how the data is collected, then we have to disclose that in a very transparent manner. Potentially there could be many possibilities.

At this stage, clearly, Statistics Canada has an enormously positive track record of collecting good-quality, reliable data. I don't foresee a future government intervening in the operational know-how, but if it does it has to be an extraordinary circumstance, and clearly it has to explain why. Also, that transparency and accountability becomes even more evident through the order in council and also by tabling it in the House.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Okay, so we have a well-defined process that says that the circumstances have to be explained, and then that has to be tabled in the House. That allows us as members to be able to discuss and get an understanding of what it needs to get there.

[Navdeep Bains, Liberal, Mississauga—Malton, ON]

That's correct. In 2011 and prior to that the minister claimed that he had received advice that having the mandatory long-form census was not necessary to collect good-quality, reliable data, which was not the case. That caused the problem in the past, so we want to avoid such a scenario going forward. Hence a level of transparency, having a clear process, and having two mechanisms in place—one through order in council and the other through the House, one at the executive level and one at the legislative level—would deal with that kind of circumstance going forward.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Just to be clear, I haven't cut the time of anybody on this side because I'm trying to make sure you all get yours in.

Mr. Jeneroux, you have five minutes.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I appreciate the clarification on the time. We certainly thought our time was being cut, so that's great. Also, just for the record they've now ceded it to the NDP so who knows who is going to get more time here?

We've moved from a 30-person council to a 10-person council. It appears to us on this side of the table that certain provinces are then going to be left out of this, in particular my province of Alberta. There is no longer a western economic diversification minister; there's Minister Bains and that is it. That goes with all the other agencies as well.

We're feeling this might be yet another cut to my home province of Alberta, keeping them out of the advisory council, which would again be in line with seeing statistics used to determine, create, and keep 1,300 jobs at a place like Bombardier while not having any sort of support for an oil and gas industry that has 160,000 people. Minister, can you help with some clarification for us in Alberta?

[Navdeep Bains, Liberal, Mississauga—Malton, ON]

Thank you for that question. It really is a point of pride and honour for me to be the minister responsible for Western Economic Diversification. It's a very important agency that provides meaningful economic development and support to Alberta and the other surrounding regions.

With regard to the composition of the new Canadian statistics advisory council, there has been no determination of who those individuals will be. I'm confident that there will be many qualified Albertans that will be applying, because they have an enormous amount of confidence in the independence of Statistics Canada and in the data that's now being produced by Statistics Canada since we moved to a mandatory long-form census, and they will be given every opportunity to move forward.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

I'm glad the selection committee has confidence; however, we are starting to really lack a lot of confidence in your department, confidence that we're not being left out. We've asked time and time again for support for the oil and gas sector, yet we see support going to a company like Bombardier. I'm curious how the statistics line up on your end of the line so that there wouldn't be support for the oil and gas industry, yet executives with Bombardier seem to be having a high rate of salary.

[Navdeep Bains, Liberal, Mississauga—Malton, ON]

Again, with regard to Statistics Canada, we look at a variety of statistics around labour market information. Clearly, we are seeing positive movement in that area. A lot of jobs are being created in the economy. This is a focal point of our government. We want to continue to see growth in all regions, and we want to see good-quality jobs created in all regions. Over the past eight months, we've seen a quarter of a million good-quality jobs being created, full-time jobs, and we want to continue to build on that momentum. That's the kind of data that I think is relevant, and that's the kind of data that Canadians care about.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

You have a minute.

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer—Mountain View, AB]

Thank you very much.

I just have a couple of things on the types of questions that are being asked. When you ask questions, it's usually because the government wants to move forward in a certain direction. You talked about clean tech, green tech, all of that—

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

If we can, let's keep it to Bill C-36, please.

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer—Mountain View, AB]

I will try to do that.

Comparing it to clean coal.... I just want to make one particular point. I was talking to some fertilizer people yesterday. They were talking about the carbon tax on natural gas, and how once that gets completely ingrained into their business they will have no opportunity to send any of their product to the U.S. because there will be no money—

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Bill C-36, Mr. Dreeshen....

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer—Mountain View, AB]

—and therefore, it's going to be replaced with coal-fired from China—

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Mr. Dreeshen, can you put it to Bill C-36, please?

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer—Mountain View, AB]

Therefore, when we talk about questions that are going to be presented to the public, let's make sure—

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Time is up.

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer—Mountain View, AB]

—that it ties into everything that's involved.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Thank you very much.

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer—Mountain View, AB]

Thank you.