Evidence of meeting #85 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was broadband.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Terry Sheehan Liberal Sault Ste. Marie, ON
Thank you very much for your presentation.
One of the questions has already been asked, but about 20 years ago, my business worked for another business. It was northern Ontario's first commerce-enabled website, but it was also an Internet service provider, a small guy. How is it that we're going to guarantee that the smaller ISPs aren't pushed out in the competition world against some of the bigger players, whose names I'm not going to say?
Director General, Connecting Canadians Branch, Department of Industry
I have to say that under Connecting Canadians and Connect to Innovate, from the applications we received, it's not just the big players that are benefiting. We have many applications from small ISPs, from municipalities, from first nations organizations. When I think of Connecting Canadians, the smallest application was for $7,000 or $8,000. Some small companies are benefiting from this.
We try to ensure that not all the funding is going to all the big players. Some really good applications have come forward from smaller ISPs.
Liberal
Terry Sheehan Liberal Sault Ste. Marie, ON
They included one from Goulais River in my riding.
CRTC, are you going to be coordinating the $750 million with the CTI folks as well?
Executive Director, Telecommunications, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
We're still in design right now, but we're designing it to be complementary to other government programs. One of the eligibility criteria that we provided in December of last year is you have to have some other government funding program to be eligible for our fund as well.
We're trying to make it complementary. It's still being designed in an open proceeding, and so I can't give you what the outcomes might be on that.
Executive Director, Telecommunications, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
The intention is to complement, and it's a shared responsibility from all levels of government, communities, service providers, and the public sector to support bridging the gap.
Liberal
Terry Sheehan Liberal Sault Ste. Marie, ON
I was taking a look at something Gord mentioned about the opportunities to connect. When we start getting into these definitions for rural broadband, there's rural and there's also remote. There's underserviced. These sorts of things are important.
Up in northern Ontario, the Matawa First Nations just benefited from an announcement, and that's five first nations in the Ring of Fire. It's $37 million from us and $30 million from the province and $2.1 million from another one. I think that's a perfect example of a partnership that's happening, because no matter where you live in Canada you should have the same opportunities as anybody else.
Could I have some comments on how that is going thus far? It was recently announced, but what are the next steps as an example of that announcement?
Director General, Connecting Canadians Branch, Department of Industry
Once a project has been selected and announced, we start to work on a contribution agreement to sign with the proponent. That's the next step, and we work closely with the proponent in doing so. Matawa is likely planning an engineering design for the fibre deployment. They would have to do an engineering design and they would likely have to....
Liberal
November 23rd, 2017 / 11:55 a.m.
Director General, Connecting Canadians Branch, Department of Industry
It's going. Is it quick? I don't want to say it's quick, but they are certainly very happy. I would think that the funding has been announced and the project has been selected and work is under way.
Liberal
Terry Sheehan Liberal Sault Ste. Marie, ON
It's important. I'm also chair of the northern Ontario caucus, and we get those questions from the time of the announcement to when it will be up and running. Quite frankly, it's not just about commerce; it's about isolation, about hopelessness in some first nations communities in northern Ontario and the rest of Canada where suicide rates are very high. People talk about this disconnect, so I think it behooves us to get the money out the door, get it into place, and get the projects up as well.
I look forward to the coordination with CRTC on the $750 million, and to the $500 million as well going forward. Again, I appreciate this really important discussion. We're talking about a semi-rural riding like mine, where Goulais River has applied. It's a really remote community with a whole bunch of problems, up in northern Ontario, that really needs these programs.
Director General, Connecting Canadians Branch, Department of Industry
Well, these are fly-in communities. When we talk about remote, we're referring to communities that don't have year-round road access.
Liberal
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Dan Ruimy
Thank you.
Just be mindful of the time. I want to make sure. We have 12 minutes left of questions. Are you all okay to stay at the 12 minutes?
Conservative
Maxime Bernier Conservative Beauce, QC
Thank you.
My question is for you, Ms. Hart, and pertains to the deployment of the new services.
You assess the applications of companies who wish to offer those services and to receive funding to do so. Yet there is not just high-speed fibre optic service. I imagine there is also satellite Internet service.
How do you decide to help a supplier provide Internet service by satellite rather than fibre optic, for a specific region?
In the regions, people sometimes prefer fibre optic access over satellite. You provide funding so companies can offer one or the other.
How do you determine the type of service that people in a given region will receive?
Director General, Connecting Canadians Branch, Department of Industry
We evaluate the applications using the criteria in our application guide. There are essential criteria and relative criteria. Technology is an essential criterion. Most of the applications we receive are for fibre optic. We consider the applications we receive. I said earlier that satellite service is offered in Nunavut. The reason is that fibre optic service would be extremely expensive. Those applications that we received were therefore for satellite service.
We consider the cost-benefit ratio, the partners, and the other stakeholders who will be investing in the project. We consider various criteria to determine the most cost-effective way of achieving the program objectives. Moreover, it is not just fibre optic and satellite service. There are also other technologies, such as wireless networks. That said, most applications are for fibre optic service. We do not decide that one location will have satellite service and another one will have fibre optic. We consider what is submitted to us and what is best for the communities.
Perhaps Mr. Delorme would like to add something.
Acting Director, Connecting Canadians Branch, Program and Engineering, Department of Industry
Yes, I would add that we really cannot comment on the Connect to Innovate program since not the project selections have not all been finalized. On the other hand, under the previous program, Connecting Canadians, the funding for satellite service was for the Far North only. In areas further south, it was really wireless land-based or fibre optic service, because satellite technologies do no have a lot of capacity as compared to land-based technology. We would rather keep that for the north, where there really is no other solution.
Conservative
Maxime Bernier Conservative Beauce, QC
I imagine you receive complaints from companies that already offer satellite services in certain regions and see competitors coming along who have public funding to offer fibre optic Internet services.
Do you often get complaints from companies, especially those offering satellite services?
In my region of Beauce, there are both types of service, satellite and fibre optic. Yet I know that the companies offering satellite service were disappointed that their competitors were in a sense being subsidized through the program.
Acting Director, Connecting Canadians Branch, Program and Engineering, Department of Industry
I have to say that satellite service is still important. Given the fixed capacity of a satellite, even the largest satellite companies try to use ground-based technologies and save the satellite capacity for when there is no other option. We will never be able to meet the needs of all underserved households in Canada by way of satellite, because there are not enough of them orbiting. When technology allows us to concentrate capacity where there is a need, that will improve service for everyone.
No, we have not heard that.
Liberal
Liberal
Frank Baylis Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
I'd like to focus on two questions: the size of the challenge and the cost of the challenge.
I'll start with you, Mr. Seidl. You gave some statistics. Where were your numbers from?
Executive Director, Telecommunications, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
They're from our annual “Communications Monitoring Report”. We do a survey each year of all the service providers in Canada. We just published that report earlier this month, and it covered both the broadcasting and telecom industry. We captured the availability of the 50/10 for the first time in this past report.