Industry Committee on Dec. 7th, 2017

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

I just want to clarify that I'm not the chief lobbyist. I'm not the chief recruiter, either, for scientists within government.

I'd just like to respond by saying that I strongly believe in the importance of intramural science. I think intramural scientists play a critical role in our country, be it for evidence-based decision-making, our regulatory processes, etc. Part of my mandate is to review the state of intramural science and to make recommendations. That is something that I will be getting into.

I guess your question is about intramural science.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

It's about the unfilled positions. It is not just this department. There are others. There are lots of unfilled positions right now. I'm wondering what the priority is on that.

I know that you're supportive of the Naylor report, but obviously, it has to come with the people to be able to do the recommendations that were suggested. For a community like mine, if we're looking at filling those positions, specific to that, what might your advice be? Is there going to be some type of support to, for example, repatriate Canadian scientists from the United States?

I thought your comments were appropriate. There are a lot of people with the credentials from Windsor and the surrounding area who have jobs in the United States who could be repatriated with the proper scientific investment in Canada. Often they come from other countries where, in Canada, their degrees aren't recognized. In fact, even in the medical system, we at times will send Canadians over to the United States to get medical treatment. They will be treated by doctors, nurses, and other health care professionals who aren't technically qualified to practise in Canada, are prohibited from doing so, and we'll pay a premium for it.

Similarly, in the science field, we have individuals and opportunities over in Detroit, Michigan, in the greater area. If we invested in science, for example, at the University of Windsor and other places, we could grow our scientific base. I'm just wondering whether there will be a coupling of that type of strategy to re-employ those scientists.

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

The University of Windsor is a great institution. In fact, the president of the University of Windsor is a good friend of mine. He's done a tremendous job for the university during his tenure over the past 10 years.

I said on day one that I'd like to do everything to make Canada a global leader in science and innovation. I'm going to work as hard as I can and help as much as I can to achieve this. I think that we have a unique opportunity. Truly, I believe that the international context is very favourable for Canada. We need to all work together to make sure that we have the infrastructure and the support, and we want all expats—and non-expats also—to come to Canada. I think this would be a great opportunity that will set us for the next 50 years as leaders in the world.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

I agree, and it's great to hear because I think it is a unique opportunity, especially given some of the U.S. policy that's going on right now. It's an opportunity for Canada, and it's going to require a plan, a strategy, and investment.

Since the scientific background is about measuring.... In terms of unfilled positions, but also moving along the lines of the Naylor report's recommendations, will you be measuring the progress in those fields?

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

This is one of the interesting things about the fundamental science review. It provides us with a baseline. All of us can measure progress, and I sure hope that we'll be measuring upward progress there.

For 11 years, while I was at the University of Ottawa, my aim was to increase the number of scientists, the amount of research and training, and the number of students exposed to research. We've done a good job there. I guess that counted somewhere in my getting the position.

I hope to do the same at the level of the country. I may be romantic, but trust me: I'm going to do my very best to accomplish this.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Thank you.

We're going to move to Mr. Jowhari.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Good morning, Dr. Nemer. Congratulations and welcome to the committee.

As a result of your opening remarks, I developed a good understanding of the role you're being asked to play. You're helping Canada to become a global leader. You helped me understand your focus on Arctic research, neuroscience, and regenerative medicine. You also touched on the large stakeholder group you are engaged with, and you're getting feedback, which all goes towards setting up that baseline you talked about.

In your opening remarks, you also touched on a work plan, and you said your department is working on it. To me, as I have a consulting background, a work plan consists of deliverables, key milestones, key activities, KPIs, and so on. Can you expand on what this work plan means to you, and what we should expect over what time period?

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

The work plan is exactly what you're mentioning. We've been looking at the mandate and the order in council. There are some specifics stated there. Under each one, we're putting in the steps that need to be taken during the coming weeks. I'm hoping we will have a work plan by the beginning of next year. I've been in this job for less than three months now. We will have a work plan with key milestones and deliverables that will say what we're going to achieve in year one, year two, and so on. This is precisely what we're working on.

It will touch on the different, broad areas that I'm mandated to look after. For example, we will look at our present system of providing advice to government and making recommendations for improvement. Another area has to do with the interactions between intramural scientists, extramural scientists, engagement with the public, and science literacy. These are the broad areas, but within each one there are some specifics that are already part of the order in council.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

From a timing point of view, when should we expect to see the work plan?

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

Like I said, we're working on the work plan. We wanted to do the consultations. I needed to get briefed on what's going on in government, specifically within government science and the big files. I'm not here to do anybody's work; I'm not here to be redundant. Rather, I'm here to be a facilitator and convenor, so I needed to understand what's going on. To be clear in my answer to your question, you can expect to have our work plan at the beginning of 2018.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

You also, as I call it, opened up and sent a message internationally. You want Canada to be a global leader, but you also invited a lot of researchers and leading scientists in different areas to Canada. I have access to a lot of international students who are doing their doctorates and post-doctorates in Canada, and they understand our culture and how our university and research systems work. What role can they play in helping you and the government achieve your mandates?

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

Do you mean the international students?

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Yes.

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

First of all, as members of the committee have probably noted, there has been a significant increase in the number of graduate students coming to Canada. I think that's great for the country. This reflects the strength of our post-secondary institutions and our reputation as a country in the world.

I am very heartened by the reception I received from the students, the international students in particular, in the different places I've been and met with them. As you said, they are very happy in Canada, and they want to contribute. You know what? They tell me that they see me as a role model and as their potential. They want to contribute to the country. They want to be given opportunities to contribute. I think this is so positive for Canada.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you. I am out of time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Mr. Eglinski, you have five minutes.

[Jim Eglinski, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

Ms. Nemer, I was doing a little research on you. You have very impressive credentials, ma'am. Welcome to the role.

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

Thank you.

[Jim Eglinski, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

When you were vice-president of research at the University of Ottawa, you mentioned, back in 2011, I think, in an article or a question that was put to you, “The challenges faced by industry often span several disciplines and require a multi-disciplinary approach; however the current blend of federal and provincial programs suffer from the disadvantage that they are often based in specific disciplines and [don't work] well together.” This is what you said.

I noticed that you mentioned that a bit in your speech, that you were going to.... I wonder if you could briefly tell me how you plan on going about that, because there are definitely clashes between disciplines sometimes.

I'll lead into a second question after that.

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

Historically, disciplines have developed in silos. I'll give you an example. Folks in the manufacturing sector never thought they needed to talk with philosophers, mathematicians, or others. Now all the disciplines are coming together.

When we have programs that are discipline-based, or programs at the federal level that address one part of the bigger picture but not the other, for example, if we address the talent but not the infrastructure, or if we address the infrastructure but not the talent, there is no harmonization among the various levels of government and also other sectors. Industry has as a very important role to play. The private sector has an important role to play, as well as philanthropic organizations.

We all want the same thing. We all want society to benefit. We all want to be happier, healthier, and more resilient, and to have jobs, etc. I think working together is the only way.

I don't know if I have answered your question.

[Jim Eglinski, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

That's fair.

In reading your mandate letter, after you were appointed chief science adviser, I see that part of your responsibility is “to ensure that government science is fully available to the public, that scientists are able to speak freely about their work”, and that scientific analyses and materials are available to the public. I think that's great.

In my riding of Yellowhead, which is central Alberta west, we have an epidemic of pine beetles. They have attacked the forests, coming out of B.C. and into Jasper National Park and the pine forests of western Alberta. We are seeing a reluctance on the part of the federal government, which almost appears to be a conflict between different science groups about how to attack the pine beetle situation. We keep hearing that we are doing science and research, but we are never told what the science and research are.

I'd like to ask a favour of you. Maybe six months down the road, to give you a little time to get settled into your position, you could supply this committee with a report on what has been done in the last two years in science and research on the pine beetle situation, and what has been given to and shared with industry, to get a better concept. It's a very big, important issue in our part of the world.

[Dr. Mona Nemer]

Thank you for the comment.

I'm sorry about what's happening there. I was also in Manitoba recently and toured our level 4 labs and heard also about some of the problems that we're facing in terms of the environment and the agriculture sector that are due to climate change and other things. As you know, my mandate is to provide the Prime Minister, the Minister of Science, and cabinet with scientific advice. Unfortunately, while I would love to engage with you on these conversations, I would be unable to provide you with a comprehensive report on this. I can certainly try to put you in touch with some of the Alberta scientists or other scientists in the country who may be able to help.

[Jim Eglinski, Conservative, Yellowhead, AB]

Thank you.

I'll turn over my last little—

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

That's it. There's nothing to turn over.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

I have a 15-second question, if we can get it in.