Industry Committee on May 11th, 2020

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Where else do you expect to connect Canadians from, if you're not going to use the proceeds from the spectrum or the spectrum itself? I've just asked a simple question. As a cabinet minister, what happened to the rest of that money and the money that's unspent from that spectrum? We can roll out further spectrum connection right now. The money is there.

The Canadian government has collected over $20 billion in spectrum alone. Just from the last budget year, the last spectrum alone—you have another one coming up—you have plenty of money to connect Canadians now. You're saying it's important for access and equality, but just not now. The geography isn't the problem. The Liberals are the problem with regard to connecting Canadians, because the money is right there in the government's bank account.

I want to know where that money is. Why did you decide, as a cabinet, to redirect that away from Canadians and connecting them? If it's so important, why not use that money to connect them now? Why go on bended knee to the private sector to try to do something, when the capital has already been raised—at no cost—from the spectrum?

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

We have invested more in connecting Canadians to high-speed Internet than any other government. If my colleague is suggesting that we are holding back in any way, I want to assure him that he is wrong.

I also want to remind him—

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

That's your own budget document. Your own budget documents say that you're spending $170 million right now, because you're going to spread the first set of investments over 10 years.

There is still that $1.77 billion. I want to know why it can't be used now to connect Canadians.

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

We are working to connect Canadians, and I want to remind my colleague that he voted against the funding we set aside to connect Canadians to high-speed Internet.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

If you want to play that game, I can do that quite easily. I can talk about how the Liberals voted against previous spectrum auctions and money used to actually connect Canadians as well.

I've been around here for a while, so I can list out, as long as the cows want to come home, the times the Liberals have voted against stuff, including my border here, including the environment, including Jack Layton's climate change bill when it was through the Senate with the senators there. I can go through a whole list, from the environment to spectrum, of what you guys voted against, if you want to play that juvenile game.

I'm simply asking you, as a cabinet minister—

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

Mr. Masse, I'm just going to ask if you can lower the tone a bit, please. It's getting a little aggressive.

Thank you.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Fair enough, Madam Chair, and I apologize if it was aggressive. I don't mean to be that way, but the reality is that when I hear about those types of things, “You voted against that; you voted against this”....

What I'm asking for right now are the resources that this government has collected, and put in their budget and talked about. The minister talked about spectrum. Where are the dollars that were gathered in the spectrum itself in the budget, and where are they now? Where is that $1.77 billion?

Why won't the government use those funds to connect Canadians now? Is there a reason to make Canadians wait? Maybe there is a reason.

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Where the funds go is to the consolidated revenue fund, firstly, and he knows this because as he's said, he's been around.

Second, we are investing heavily to connect as many Canadians as possible. That plan is working. There is no plan to hold back. If anything, because of COVID-19, we are accelerating those investments.

It's great to see this level of passion, Madam Chair. We're going to need it, and cross-party support, to further accelerate investments.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

My simple point in this is that you have the monies for it now. You don't have to wait around for the private sector.

You created the spectrum where there's a significant cost and there are significant black holes. Why can't that money be used by the government now to accelerate the timeline to connect Canadians? Why is it okay to be equal later but not equal now, especially when kids and other people are connecting to their education, their businesses, their futures.

We have disproportionate costs. Even in communities such as mine that are connected, we have some of the most challenged areas, with some of the highest costs in this country. We have some of the biggest disadvantaged groups, from new immigrants to existing Canadians in impoverished areas. You're making them wait for lower prices and you're making them wait for service.

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

No, we're not.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

That's all the time for that round. For our second round of questions, we have MP Patzer for five minutes.

You have the floor.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

I'm going to continue along the same path that MP Masse was on with Minister Monsef here.

The news actually keeps getting worse. As I look at the connectivity strategy for Canada document put out by the Liberal government for budget 2019, the $1.7 billion is actually for 13 years, which is going to take us to 2032. Why do we have to wait until 2032 to connect rural communities to broadband?

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

We don't, and as my colleague knows with two projects in his own riding well under way because of our investments, we are seizing every moment to connect as many Canadians as possible.

Broadband infrastructure projects take time. We're building the type of infrastructure that can be future-proof, so that it can support additional technological investments. Our government sees this as an economic imperative, as well as one to address inequality across the country.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Yes, I actually spent 10 years working in telecommunications in this province, so I'm keenly aware of investments that have been made in the province, both in the last couple of years but long before that as well.

One of the other things I was reading about in the document was that it speaks about an online portal for municipalities to see all the funding available and how to apply for it. What is the name of the website? Is it up and running, and is it getting used?

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Canada.ca/getconnected allows communities across the country to test their Internet speed. It allows for a comprehensive map, which is a significant tool for communities to apply for these projects. We are working to further fine-tune our efforts, as well as our tools, to make sure that more Canadians, particularly those in smaller communities without as much capacity to get grant writing and projects under way, are able to access and provide that service to their communities.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Okay, but a website for a speed test doesn't direct municipalities to where they can apply for funding.

Would you mind trying again?

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

The universal broadband fund isn't open yet. However, Canada.ca/getconnected is where folks can go now and where information about programs will be once the universal broadband fund opens.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Okay, so they'll be able to go to that exact website to find out where they can apply for funding. That's good to know.

Further on, when you're talking about the mapping, right now one of the issues we have with mapping is that lots of companies actually use a low-quality signal mapping. They use that as a means to mislead consumers. They say, “Oh, we have your whole area covered,” when the reality is that they don't, because obviously you can't do anything with a low-quality signal.

Can you confirm that these maps are high-quality signal mapping?

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Yes. My colleague is referring to the hexagon model, which we heard from stakeholders was leaving too many underserved communities out of the scope, so we've now changed the maps so that the radius they cover is within 250 metres. These are more accurate and will lead to more Canadians getting connected.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Is that going to be high quality, though, and not just so that they can get a signal?

The reason I'm concerned is that we're looking at 50/10 megabits per second as a threshold, and right now, companies can say, “Oh, that's provided there.” However, when you do a test, you don't even get remotely close to that. That's where the issue lies.

Will it be high-quality signal on that map, or will it continue to mislead consumers?

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

It's a high-quality map. It has been improved, and if folks are looking for applications and announcements, go to Canada.ca/getconnected. You'll be able to do that speed test, you'll be able to see that map, and you'll be able to get connected to other programs, such as through the CRTC fund, which is accepting applications right now.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

You talked about low-orbit satellites. Are you thinking that is going to be one of the main drivers to providing rural Canadians with reliable Internet?

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

I think low-earth orbit satellites are going to be needed to connect harder-to-reach communities, particularly in rural, remote and more northern communities. There is a set of tools, though, and high-quality fibre is a big part of our plan.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Yes, because wired is always better. The more we can invest in fibre, the better. Is that part of your plan?

[Maryam Monsef, Liberal, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Yes, and it's good to see us on the same page.