Evidence of meeting #17 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 43rd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was data.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC
If you go down much smaller, how accurate is it? Then you have a much smaller user base and people are much closer.
Head, Government Affairs and Public Policy, Google Canada
The existing reports reflect that data gap. Some of the classifications for the territories have major gaps in the trend lines because enough information isn't available to us to anonymize and aggregate to a level that meets our expectations around privacy.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sherry Romanado
Thank you very much.
Our next round of questions goes to MP Ehsassi. You have five minutes.
Liberal
Ali Ehsassi Liberal Willowdale, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
I'll be sharing my time with Mr. Erskine-Smith.
I have a quick question for Mr. McKay and Ms. Arjomandi. Mr. McKay, as you've noted, it's going to be challenging to get meaningful participation from enough people in a jurisdiction. Another thing I've been following is that in the U.K. a lot of people had a hard time registering if they had old Android phones; they were not compatible and they couldn't participate. How do you intend to get around that particular challenge?
Head, Government Affairs and Public Policy, Google Canada
We're working hard to make sure that the vast majority of Android phones are able to take advantage of exposure notification, and then the subsequent OS improvements. It will be a case where it's more than a significant majority through most of our operating systems.
Liberal
Ali Ehsassi Liberal Willowdale, ON
Thank you.
Ms. Arjomandi, I know Mimik has a very strong record behind it. I know that your company has had its eyes on the ball and has been beavering away, if you will, for the last couple of months. What has your experience been in Canada? How come you haven't launched an application to date?
Founder, President and Chief Executive Officer, Mimik
For the solutions to be adopted and distributed, we need government and our health authorities to build experience with it. With regard to the policy we were just discussing here, the question is how to configure and provide confidence to the users that their data is getting protected and it's in their control.
I'm doing contact tracing for me. If I do that contact tracing for me and for my own well-being, with the assurance that I can share data where I need it to help me, then I will do it. That's why we have engagement with large enterprises, but for the direct-to-consumer solution we would like to have some engagement from governments. We have reached out to so many federal and provincial government entities and health organizations, but so far, I guess everybody's busy. We're hoping to get heard for the direct-to-consumer solution.
Liberal
Nathaniel Erskine-Smith Liberal Beaches—East York, ON
Thanks, Ali.
Mr. McKay, has anyone from the Government of Canada been in touch with Google to work together on a proximity tracing application?
Head, Government Affairs and Public Policy, Google Canada
We're in conversations with the federal government and the provincial governments about the possible use of the encounter notifications API.
Liberal
Nathaniel Erskine-Smith Liberal Beaches—East York, ON
Is the same true of the provincial government here in Ontario?
Liberal
Nathaniel Erskine-Smith Liberal Beaches—East York, ON
What happens in a few months when you roll out the secondary plan for the public health applications? Are they rendered moot in some fashion?
Head, Government Affairs and Public Policy, Google Canada
No. It's an improvement to the technology. Rather than relying on an API the OS itself is improved so the app can continue in the same process.
Liberal
Nathaniel Erskine-Smith Liberal Beaches—East York, ON
We've had a conversation tonight about opt-in versus opt-out. Is it technologically possible, in your view, to have an opt-out system?
Head, Government Affairs and Public Policy, Google Canada
It's technologically possible. Do you mean by forced download?
Head, Government Affairs and Public Policy, Google Canada
If you're thinking about a forced download process—
Liberal
Head, Government Affairs and Public Policy, Google Canada
Yes, in our case we require the user to consent to the download of an application.
Liberal
Nathaniel Erskine-Smith Liberal Beaches—East York, ON
No, I know. Of course, I understand that Apple-Google's current system is very strongly supportive of opt-in. I completely get it, but I'm just talking about technical feasibility. Would it be technically possible to have an opt-out system, if I automatically updated an OS?
Head, Government Affairs and Public Policy, Google Canada
At the moment, when an update is sent to a phone you have the ability as the phone user to not consent to the update. That exists for the app and the OS.
Liberal
Nathaniel Erskine-Smith Liberal Beaches—East York, ON
Mr. Johnson, to my understanding, every province uses Panorama. Does every province maximize its use of Panorama in the same way?
Partner, British Columbia Public Sector, Global Business Services, IBM Canada
No, and in fact, every province doesn't use it. Seven provinces and one territory currently use it. The immunization and vaccine inventory is in seven provinces, plus one territory, which is about 86% of our population of Canada having their immunization data in the database. However, outbreak management is only in a few of the provinces, five provinces.
Liberal