Industry Committee on Oct. 29th, 2020

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair. Two and a half minutes isn't much time.

I'd like to know whether Ms. Campbell has anything else to add on the matter of farmers. I asked her the question quickly before because I was worried we wouldn't have time for a second round.

I'd also like you to comment on the relationship between the Canadian Space Agency and industries across Quebec and Canada. You touched on the research happening at the university level. How does that benefit Canada's GDP? Is there really a procurement policy to support industries domestically?

[Lisa Campbell]

Thank you for your questions.

In response to your question about farmers, I'll give you an example. FarmersEdge, a Winnipeg company, combines satellite data with data collected on the ground to provide farmers with greater precision to support their operations. This helps farmers obtain more with less, using less water and fertilizer, for instance. They are the same data Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada uses. The company is able to leverage the data to deliver greater efficiency.

As for Quebec companies, I mentioned the industrial benefits policy. We make every possible effort through each procurement process and the innovation fund to support small and medium-sized businesses in Canada.

As you may know, our headquarters are in Saint-Hubert. I should point out that 90% of our staff live in the area. That's true for me as well. I just moved from Prince Edward Island to Saint-Bruno. It's wonderful to see companies with artificial intelligence expertise directly benefiting from the work we do. We see it every day. This week, I was talking to people from a company that grew by 100%. The company is here, in Quebec, and has clients all over the world. We take great pride in that.

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

You also mentioned that the Canadarm3 was under development. You piqued my curiosity. What will it be used for? What can we expect?

[Lisa Campbell]

The project leverages all of our robotics expertise. I'm not sure whether you've had a chance to look at the Gateway project. It will be a lunar space station 400,000 kilometres from earth. It will house astronauts for 30 days, but will be uninhabited after that. The Canadarm3 will be able to perform various repairs and tasks, supporting the lunar outpost Gateway when no humans are aboard.

What we are working on is very impressive, and it is thanks to all the expertise we've acquired. We are seeing our investments bear fruit. This is truly a sign of confidence from our international partners.

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Thank you.

Again, I wish you all the best in your first term.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

Thank you.

Our next round will go to MP Bachrach. You have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Ms. Campbell, again, my congratulations to you.

I'm very curious about two things related to satellites, one being the low earth orbit satellites and their potential for delivering rural broadband in regions such as the one I represent—which I think that's probably the main one. The other concern related to satellites is that there's currently a communications satellite managed by Telesat that delivers Internet to northwest British Columbia and other rural parts of Canada and that service is being discontinued at the end of December. I'm wondering if you could comment on both of them and how we best utilize satellite programs to deliver rural broadband service.

[Lisa Campbell]

I'll reiterate what I said earlier, which is that our core mandate is space exploration. Low earth orbit satellites, and satellites generally, are obviously an area that we're very interested in for the data they generate. Connectivity is one of the important benefits. Telesat is a commercial community, and they are very active in this space, as you know. Connectivity for Canadians is obviously something that we know is important. We're seeing this through our work, and the pandemic, unfortunately, has highlighted some of those issues, as we've even seen here today. We are very interested in growing the potential uses of satellite data, as I mentioned.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you for the clarification.

I'll pass it back to Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

Thank you very much.

We will go to MP Nater for five minutes.

[John Nater, Conservative, Perth—Wellington, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, again, to our witnesses.

I want to follow up. Again I recognize what Mr. Bachrach was talking about, the points I raised earlier, and that these might not be part of the core competencies of the Canadian Space Agency, but obviously, satellites are a point of interest for the Canadian Space Agency. We hear of large government investments in Telesat, for example, but then we look south of the border and SpaceX seems to be eating everybody else's lunch. They're ready to flip a switch and serve massive swathes of Canada with high-speed Internet tomorrow, whereas other domestic Canadian companies are not quite there yet. I'm curious for your opinion on where Canada is as an industry in competing on the world stage and whether or not we're lagging behind.

[Lisa Campbell]

We need to create a favourable regulatory framework; it needs to be a good place to do business for space companies, and be favourable to Canadian companies. We happen to think that the current framework is a bit dated. It needs to be easier for people to access high-quality data so they can use it. People often ask us why we still need to invest in building and owning satellites. Our current RADARSAT constellation is good until 2026, after which we want to think about the next option. We've let contracts to companies to help us with that, so they're brainstorming now and will come to us with proposals.

We know this is an area where there is a need for government presence, because a lot of this data has public use, and many countries are seeing massive returns on investment from opening up the data, making it available to businesses and then seeing lots of downstream benefits. It's also true, though, as you point out, that commercial companies are entering this space and creating a lot of data that they then sell and commercialize. Nonetheless, we're seeing around the world that both are happening at the same time, because they have different end uses. We want Canada to be well-positioned to take part in what is really a new space economy. My colleague Ms. Preville has called data the “new workhorse of space”.

[John Nater, Conservative, Perth—Wellington, ON]

Thank you for that. I think I would probably agree that we do need an updated regulatory structure in place to deal with that, because I do think that right now we're actually blocking SpaceX, for example, from coming into the Canadian marketplace, which would have benefited....

I think everyone on this call would agree that we'd all prefer to see Canadian companies taking the lead on that, but when you have an American company that's able to deliver the product that's needed by so many millions of Canadians, the fact that our regulatory environment is actually blocking that I think is unfortunate. That's not a question, just more of a comment, but I do want to go on to a question.

The lunar gateway project is obviously a major priority for the agency. It's $2.05 billion over 24 years, I believe, and is obviously a massive investment and a priority for the space agency, but, like anything, when you focus on one thing, other priorities are obviously less focused on, shall we say. Again, I want to go back to growing good nutritious food. How much is the impact of that investment forcing us to have a lesser investment on growing conditions in harsh climates? That's where where I think Canada has a great deal of expertise, but it seems to me that we're lagging in terms of focusing on that side of things while focusing on robotics and the development of the astronaut program.

I just want to get your thoughts on whether we're placing less of a priority—I don't want to say neglecting—on those issues while focusing on robotics and the lunar mission.

[Lisa Campbell]

Thank you.

Actually, data is one of our priorities. We are making sure to unlock the economic potential that satellite data offers, both in areas where we traditionally think of it and in many other areas as well. I mean, there are probably applications we haven't even conceived of yet, but once we unlock the data and make it available to companies, they'll come back with solutions for us.

We do need to prioritize, though, and build on our strengths, and we know that for us in Canada it is robotics. It's artificial intelligence. It's our expertise in health care. We bring huge value to the table with our international partners, which is why they keep asking us back.

Thank you.

[John Nater, Conservative, Perth—Wellington, ON]

Thank you.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I saw you wave the 30-second banner at me, which means that I really can't get into my next line of questioning, other than to thank our witnesses and relay to them the fact that there's a four-year-old future astronaut at home who's quite interested in the work you're doing.

Thank you again for joining us.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

Thank you very much, Mr. Nater.

Our last round of questions will go to MP Jaczek.

You have the floor for five minutes.

[Helena Jaczek, Liberal, Markham—Stouffville, ON]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I'll be sharing my time with MP Jowhari.

Congratulations to both appointees.

My question is for Ms. Walden. I have to confess that I'd never heard of the Canadian Tourism Commission or Destination Canada before today's meeting. You have a long history, obviously, with Destination British Columbia, and I'm sure that in that role you did engage in trying to attract international tourism, obviously, to beautiful British Columbia.

My question is a very basic one. What sort of value does Destination Canada add to the individual provincial efforts and individual municipal efforts that I think we're very familiar with? In your new role, apart from your difficulties with COVID, obviously, do you see any other areas that Destination Canada could engage in to assist local efforts?

[Marsha Walden]

Thank you so much for the question.

The tourism ecosystem is a very complex one of different partnerships across our nation and, really, across the world. When I was with Destination British Columbia, which was one of the provincial partners in Team Canada, we very much worked with Destination Canada and our provincial and territorial counterparts to ensure that where we had overlaps, they were productive overlaps.

We are the leading entity for international marketing. We work with our partners to ensure that specific interests of our provincial and territorial demand stimulation programs are represented. Traditionally, those partners would invest in programs that we take internationally, where we have key account relationships in key markets around the world. Those have proven to be extremely beneficial for Canada as a whole, but also for individual regions within Canada.

In terms of where we see our future role, one of the key elements of being competitive as a destination within a world where growth is, or was, very much a part of our future was to ensure that we had a product on the ground that remained competitive, that remained innovative and that was responding to the changing needs of travellers every day. That's where we see a more important strategic role for Destination Canada going forward—taking the demand-side information and market intelligence that we have and helping industry understand where the private and public sector can come together to make our product more competitive on the ground. That will be a new area for us, which we see as critical to our competitiveness as a nation.

[Helena Jaczek, Liberal, Markham—Stouffville, ON]

Over to MP Jowhari.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you to my colleagues.

Once again, congratulations to both of you.

Madam Campbell, in the last parliamentary session, this committee heard testimony about how foreign investment can undermine our national security and reduce innovation. As a lawyer who has established a name in both defence procurement and merger evaluation—and you've also highlighted the fact that data as well is part of your portfolio—do you think Canada's legislative framework and its administration provide sufficient protection against foreign investment?

[Lisa Campbell]

That's a big question. Speaking in my current capacity as president of the Canadian Space Agency, I will say that we view data as inherent to sovereignty. It is part of our security. Understanding our vast territory and being the owners of and being able to wield the data about our territory helps us support the people wherever they are, from coast to coast to coast.

We also know that having a presence with our allies in space is important. We promote the peaceful use and exploration of space. We know that not every country views it that way. That's why we're signing up to things like the Artemis Accords, which in our view are consistent with international law in this area. We will continue to work. Canada has a very special place in the world. We have credibility, which we need to maintain, so we work hard to keep an international presence for the benefit of Canadians but also the world.

Thank you.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

Thank you very much.

Our time for this part of the meeting has come to an end. I'd like to thank our witnesses for being here today and to welcome Ms. Campbell to the south shore of Montreal, where I'm from. I'm looking forward to a visit at CSA.

I'd like to thank everyone who was here today.

We will suspend while we prepare to move into this next session of the meeting.

[Proceedings continue in camera]