Evidence of meeting #105 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was meeting.
A recording is available from Parliament.
O.C., As an Individual
Yes. Deloitte was the chosen organization that was by our side as we instituted and made all the changes in the various governance parts of the organization. They were side by side with us, as we wanted an independent group of people with us as we did that.
We looked at best practices. Many of the practices in the organization were very good. We were very proud of the document that we produced. I'm sure that if you asked Simon Kennedy.... I think he is happy with the work we have done.
Liberal
Viviane LaPointe Liberal Sudbury, ON
Have you had the opportunity or do you plan to share the changes that have been made with internal and external stakeholders? I'm thinking of employees as well as partners of the organization.
O.C., As an Individual
Absolutely. Sharing internally is the most important. We have an enormous.... I shouldn't say “we”, because I'm no longer there.
The management team is working very closely with all the employees in that organization to make sure we are following these new processes and developing the discipline to make sure there's a comfort level with the government, the board and the organization to make stuff happen. The ISED organization is working very closely with them. The management team and the board are working shoulder to shoulder to make sure that there is confidence, that there's discipline and that all of these upgraded procedures are executed.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
Thank you very much, Ms. Lapointe. Your speaking time is up.
Mr. Perkins.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Ms. Verschuren, on the COVID payments, management's original intent was to fund the companies that were pre-revenue and had an analysis done of the run rate of their cash, or how much cash they would have left. It would then fund only those that were in trouble.
Is that not correct?
O.C., As an Individual
There were occasions when projects would be proposed by companies that were making revenue.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
That wasn't my question, though. Please, would you answer my question?
The original proposal was to fund only those companies that were pre-revenue and that had a cash flow issue. Yes or no?
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
You don't believe that? Management has told me that. We'll have some management here in the future, perhaps.
The claim you made was that all of these were going to companies that needed the cash. Some of them had 100 months of cash on hand. Others, like Canfor.... Canfor pulp, which is a very profitable global company, got almost $700,000 of COVID relief money.
Could Canfor pulp—and all of your revenue companies—not have applied for CEBA instead of being funded by the green slush fund?
O.C., As an Individual
I don't have the details, but this was likely a clean-tech project in either the management of forests or the improvement of all the things we're doing to—
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
I didn't ask what the project was about.
I have the list. The list says you gave them $652,500 in March 2020. They weren't struggling for revenue.
I'll move on. I don't understand why you're giving massive global companies COVID money, and why you thought you had to bail it out when the government already was.
Liberal
Peter Fragiskatos Liberal London North Centre, ON
I have a point of order, Chair. This has happened a few times, and it's just happened again. The witness is trying to give an answer, and she's cut off.
If we could just have the witness give that full answer, I think it would benefit the committee. I'm not here as a full member; I am substituting today, but I think that's just basic decorum.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
Mr. Fragiskatos, you are correct.
Mr. Perkins, it's important, out of fairness, to let the witness answer. I would let Madam Verschuren maybe take a—
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
On that point of order, if the witness will actually answer the question....
These are simple questions. She's a sophisticated business person. She understands what cash flow, balance sheets and income statements are. She can answer the question without trying to explain to us what the company is or what the project is. That has never been the question.
In the limited time, I would appreciate it if she would actually answer the question, or I will continue to try to get her back on subject.
December 14th, 2023 / 11:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
Mr. Perkins, I'll let you continue with the two minutes and 13 seconds you have left, but I would appreciate it if you left some time for the witness to answer your further questions.
Go ahead, Mr. Perkins.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
I will move on.
Andrew Noseworthy, the ADM at the industry department sat in on all your board meetings. Is that correct?
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
What was his role in sitting in on the board meetings? What would he do? Would he participate at all?
O.C., As an Individual
He was an observer. Yes, he would participate and talk more about updates at ISED, etc.
He saw all the proceedings of the board.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Did he make reports back, either to his boss—the deputy minister, Simon Kennedy—or to the minister, about what was happening?
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Outside of those meetings, did you ever have conversations with him about the role of SDTC and its relationship with the government and their priorities?
O.C., As an Individual
On occasion I did speak with him. He and I would talk on the telephone. We would talk about proceedings, etc.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Was he relaying any of that? Would he say he was relaying that or talking to the deputy, or that it would get reported back at all?