Industry Committee on April 17th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Mr. Vis, I appreciate your intervention. However, that doesn't answer my question.

What is the term of the motion we're voting on? You read something different from what has been distributed.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Maybe, Mr. Gaheer, you can give me a proposed timeline. You said 48 hours might be too short. What's your proposal?

[Iqwinder Gaheer, Liberal, Mississauga—Malton, ON]

Mr. Vis, I wasn't commenting on the merits of your motion. I just think, practically speaking, that 48 hours isn't very realistic.

Again, it's not a one-pager that was signed with Volkswagen. I'm sure it's 100 pages or 200 pages. Who knows? I'm sure it has to be translated into both languages and verified. It could be partially in German. Who knows?

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

We've had two weeks already. Do you want another week? What do you want to put in there? Give me a number.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Mr. Vis, I haven't recognized you. Mr. Gaheer has the floor.

I would ask members to wait until I yield the floor to them to intervene. This is not a debate.

Go ahead, Mr. Gaheer.

[Iqwinder Gaheer, Liberal, Mississauga—Malton, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I know it's been a little while, but there has been only one meeting since the last one at which this was brought up. I ask for good faith on the part of Mr. Vis.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

I have Mr. Masse and then Mr. Vis, but before we spend too much time, it would be important to know the terms of the motion that's before the committee. The one I have in front of me, which has been circulated, does not have a timeline. Is this the one before the committee right now, Mr. Vis?

It reads as follows:

That the committee order the department of Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada to provide a copy of papers, including the total cost of the Government of Canada investment and the number of projected jobs to be created by Volkswagen as a result of the Government of Canada investment in Volkswagen to develop a new battery plant in Canada.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

That is the motion before the committee, but I will accept Mr. Gaheer's amendment to add a timeline.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

He was proposing an amendment on removing the timeline. That's the motion before the committee.

Thank you, Mr. Vis, for the clarification.

Mr. Masse, go ahead.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Just in the interest of compromise, would one week be sufficient to do that? Then we could get back to our witnesses. I know now it doesn't have a timeline, but we heard 24 hours and 48 hours, so I don't know whether we're going to go through a dance on time.

If we are going to go through a timeline period, then I think one week would probably be reasonable for all parties.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Mr. Lemire, go ahead.

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Thank you, Chair.

I also suggest that our discussion take place in camera. I think it’s important for parliamentarians to have this information. However, I realize that certain aspects pertain to Canada’s competitiveness.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Currently, the motion does not stipulate a timeline or going in camera.

Mr. Masse has moved an amendment that we need to deal with before we move on to Mr. Lemire’s amendment, which would add a one-week deadline. Once we have dealt with that amendment, we will be able to deal with Mr. Lemire’s amendment asking that this take place in camera.

This makes the process more cumbersome than the original motion. Mr. Masse, I understand that you are proposing an amendment that would add a one-week timeline to the motion.

Mr. Masse’s amendment is now before the committee.

If no one has anything to add, we will proceed to a vote.

Mr. Vis, you have the floor.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

I will accept Mr. Masse's amendment to provide an additional week for the Government of Canada to provide the contract signed with Volkswagen Canada, the total cost to the Canadian taxpayers and the number of jobs that will be created through this government investment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Thank you, Mr. Vis.

I gather, from looking around, that the Conservatives are in agreement, as are the Bloc's Mr. Lemire, as well as Mr. Masse. Looking at the Liberals, I don't know if I need to call a vote on this amendment to add one week. I'm trying to see from my colleagues if there is consensus on this amendment or not, and whether I need to call a vote.

Go ahead, Mr. Van Bynen.

[Tony Van Bynen, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

It's a one-week timeline. Is that correct? That's all it is. Is that correct?

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

We're adding a one-week timeline.

The amendment is to add one week as a timeline to the motion that has been circulated electronically. I see consensus around the table.

(Amendment agreed to)

Now we have Mr. Lemire's amendment.

Mr. Lemire moved to add that whatever the department produces should be provided to the committee, but not made public. It would therefore be available, in camera, to committee members.

Mr. Vis, you have the floor.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

With all due respect, Mr. Lemire, I'd be opposed to that, because the purpose of my bringing forward this motion was that the information be made public.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Go ahead, Monsieur Masse.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

I can support the motion, because we could go back to a public meeting right away afterward, depending on what we get back. I'm also worried about getting total redaction of anything coming back to the committee. I don't like going in camera, but I'm willing to start in camera and then decide to go back in public later on if there's appropriateness at that time.

I'm giving the benefit of the doubt and, with the concern Mr. Lemire is bringing forward in good faith, noting that we could just go back in public again if we need to.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

I'll just give a point of clarification.

I believe that what Mr. Lemire is proposing with respect to in camera, is that the results be sent to members’ personal email address and that they be considered confidential, as are the draft reports. Of course, under these circumstances, committee members are required not to make public the information they've received.

According to Mr. Vis’ comments, I believe he disagrees.

Mr. Perkins, you have the floor.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I understand that there may be parts of the contract that are confidential, and I assume, regardless of whether we're in camera or whether it's through our private email, the government's going to redact them anyway. Therefore, it's kind of useless to get this information that says how much money has been committed on taxpayers for how many jobs without being able to talk about that publicly. I don't support the amendment if that's what it prevents us from doing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

I see that the Conservatives oppose the amendment while the Bloc and NDP support it.

Seeing no consensus, we will proceed to a vote.

(The amendment is negatived: nays, 9; yeas, 2)

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

It’s pretty rare to see the Liberals and Conservatives agreeing on something. I feel like taking a picture.

If there are no more interventions, then I will call a vote on the motion as amended by Mr. Masse, with a one-week timeline.

(Motion agreed to: yeas,11; nays, 0)

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Thank you for your co-operation.

I apologize to the witnesses who have joined us today. These things happen at committee. We can now return to today’s agenda.

Mr. Vis, you have about five minutes.