Subcommittee on International Human Rights Committee on April 24th, 2012

[Dr. Payam Akhavan]

Very briefly, I would go back to my first recommendation, which is that the Canadian government should consider how it can provide technological assistance to Iranian civil society groups as a means of bypassing all the obstructions and filters that the government has created in cyberspace. That very simple measure can go very far in helping to keep alive the civil society movement.

[Wai Young, Conservative, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, I would like to pass the time back to any other person.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Thank you very much.

You have already answered my colleague's question about the awareness on the street. Are they also aware of the significant role that Iran plays in propping up the Syrian regime?

[Dr. Payam Akhavan]

The better-informed Iranians are most definitely aware of that. The regime has tried very hard to once again claim ownership over the Arab Spring. When the uprising took place in Egypt, the regime tried to portray it as reminiscent of the revolution in 1979, which overthrew the Shah, rather than the revolution in 2009, which tried to overthrow the Islamic Republic. But I believe the regime is very concerned. The public is quite aware, because they're skeptical of what the official propaganda is. So I would say that, yes, there is an awareness of what is happening in Syria.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Particularly the regime's role in propping up the Assad regime.

[Dr. Payam Akhavan]

Yes, as I said, among the better-informed Iranians.

One of the points I wanted to mention is that a lot of the members of the Iranian opposition are really deeply frustrated by the foreign policy of Iran. For example, during the protest following the Green Movement, people were heard chanting in the street, “We don't care about Gaza or Lebanon, we only care about Iran”, meaning to say, why are we spending hundreds of millions of dollars to prop up Hamas and Hezbollah and Assad when there's rampant poverty, unemployment, drug addiction, prostitution, a whole range of terrible social and economic ills?

So the average Iranian doesn't care about exporting the Islamic revolution abroad. They care about bread and butter issues that the regime has failed to deliver on, which is why millions of people poured out in the streets in 2009, and which is why sooner or later they will pour back out on the streets, simply because the regime cannot meet their basic needs.

[The Chair, Conservative, Scott Reid]

We're out of time now.

We have one last questioner—Mr. Jacob.

I just want to mention that we will have a bus to take members back to the House, so we needn't worry that we're going to miss question period.

Mr. Jacob, I would like to welcome you to our committee. You have the floor.

[Pierre Jacob, NDP, Brome—Missisquoi, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I have a specific question I would like to ask. Where do things currently stand with respect to Mr. Soofi's deportation procedure? My question is for Mr. Akhavan.

[Payam Akhavan]

Thank you for your question.

I am not the lawyer for Mr. Soofi, so I cannot speak in terms of where the process is. I believe there was a pre-removal risk assessment, which held that he may be deported to Iran. Mr. Soofi's lawyer has now challenged that before the Federal Court, and the matter has been remanded once again to the same immigration officer who initially held that he should be deported.

I am afraid I don't know the details, but I believe that under the circumstances, it is unthinkable that someone like him should be sent to the arms of death and torture while at the United Nations we are condemning Iran's human rights abuses.

[Pierre Jacob, NDP, Brome—Missisquoi, QC]

Thank you.

What multilateral steps can a country like Canada take in order to improve the human rights situation in Iran? What other countries are concerned about the human rights situation in Iran and what tangible steps have they taken to improve things? I realize that when we talk about means, we are talking about means that will not punish the people but will send a clear signal to the Iranian government.

Mr. Akhavan, my questions are for you.

[Dr. Payam Akhavan]

Very quickly, sir, I gave you the example of providing technological assistance in order to empower civil society, to give them access to the Internet, to regulate the use of satellite television so the Iranian regime cannot block broadcasts that are hostile to it while it engages in broadcasts to perpetuate its own hate propaganda. Then there are the sanctions that target individuals for human rights abuses. The United Nations Security Council has adopted targeted sanctions against those involved in a nuclear industry. Why not impose those sanctions against those responsible for crimes against humanity?

I believe the leaders would take notice that they were marked, that they were blacklisted, and that one day they might pay a price for their terrible deeds.

[Pierre Jacob, NDP, Brome—Missisquoi, QC]

Thank you very much for these suggestions. Often everything hinges on information. It is not only about money.

Thank you, Mr. Akhavan.

[Payam Akhavan]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Scott Reid]

This brings us to the end of our current set of witnesses, so I want to take the opportunity on behalf of the committee to thank both of them.

I have one question of my own for Professor Akhavan.

You are in New York right now. Is that correct?

[Dr. Payam Akhavan]

Yes, that's correct.

[The Chair, Conservative, Scott Reid]

Is that a Tim Hortons cup you're using?

[Dr. Payam Akhavan]

Sir, I'm a true Canadian patriot.

[The Chair, Conservative, Scott Reid]

All right. You are to be congratulated.

Thanks to both of our witnesses.

I do want to deal with just one item of committee business, if I can, for the rest of us here. We've been contacted by Amnesty International, which suggests that we invite as a witness someone who could provide some information regarding the Copts and their treatment in Egypt. It's a man named Mohamed Lotfy, who was present in Egypt for about six months starting around the time of initial Tahrir Square....

According to the letter I've received, he conducted meetings with each of the political parties in Egypt on behalf of Amnesty International, trying to get their views regarding human rights protection and promotion. He is available, if we want to meet with him, on May 1, which is currently a vacant meeting. That is a possibility that I throw out to members.

Are there any feelings on that?

Are you okay with that too, Professor Cotler?

Okay, let's put him in then. Good.

All right. That's all the business we have.

Thanks to our witnesses. Thanks to members.

The meeting is adjourned.