Evidence of meeting #129 for Subcommittee on International Human Rights in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was rohingya.
A video is available from Parliament.
Conservative
David Anderson Conservative Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK
I'll have one of the other panellists here answer that question.
Conservative
David Anderson Conservative Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK
The military has forced the Rohingya out of Myanmar. That allows them to free up resources to move into other areas. Have you seen that happen? Is that what you're seeing, that they're strengthened in the other areas, in the Kachin and Karen areas? Could you talk a bit about that?
I think Ms. Ullah would also like to say something.
Chair, Karen Community of Canada
Yes, the military has the policy of Burmanization. It is not only in one ethnic area, but it's across Burma. In the Kachin, Karen, Shan and Arakan states, human rights violations have been going on. It's getting worse and worse. Burma is going backwards now, in 2018.
President, Rohingya Human Rights Network
May I add to that?
Because the Rakhine state is one of the most deforested areas in Burma, even though the entire area is already gone and the resources have already been extracted, it's still being used as a route to smuggle timber and teak from other areas, such as Shan State, Karen State and Kachin State, to be sold in Bangladesh and other countries.
You see the same thing happening with the pipeline being built from Kyaukpyu township right through Yunnan Province. That's to basically move around the oil from the Middle Eastern countries. These are not just built along Rakhine State, but crossing over many other areas. What we see in Rakhine State specifically is that they've destroyed a lot of mountains and natural resources with a lot of mining involved. These cause a lot of environmental havoc. It destroyed a lot of the coastal area and made cyclones and other environmental problems quite a bit worse.
Conservative
David Sweet Conservative Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON
I have only 45 seconds, but let me say that you're champions. I'm certain everybody here feels the same way. What you've survived is extraordinary.
You are to be commended not only for that, but for spending your time defending your people, rather than just taking relief in a free country like Canada. I just want to say thank you very much for that.
Unfortunately, that is all I have the opportunity to do, so I appreciate your testimony.
Ms. Anita Vandenbeld (Ottawa West—Nepean, Lib.)
Thank you very much.
We're now going to move on to Mr. Tabbara for seven minutes.
Liberal
Marwan Tabbara Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Thank you very much to all the witnesses here. Thank you very much for your advocacy. I've been at some of the meetings in and around Kitchener-Waterloo, and your strength continues on.
I have two questions, and I'll be splitting my time with Ms. Khalid.
It's two parts: the conditions of the Rohingya returning to Rakhine State, and the states in and around Myanmar. The Indonesian president, Joko Widodo, was quoted as saying that “Indonesia is ready...to help the Myanmar government to create a conducive condition in the Rakhine State”.
There have been individuals leaving Bangladesh and going back to Myanmar. There were 100 arrested off a boat just off Yangon. With other governments saying that they're there to help and to assist, are the conditions for the Rohingya any better at all?
I will start with Ms. Arkani.
As an Individual
I would like to say that we have regular contact with my relatives. They are still in Buthidaung in Arakan State, and also some of them are in camps. What we hear from them is that the government is building concentration camps. What we mean by concentration camps is that they're building houses surrounded by an iron fence with guards. What does that mean? If we can't go back safely, then.... Does living inside an iron fence mean we can really go there? What is the guarantee?
The other thing you mentioned was the 106 people going by boat. They were fleeing to Malaysia, but the government arrested them in Yangon, in Kyauktan, and gave them NVCs. This is the other thing. What choice do they have? They have to accept the NVC, or they have to go jail.
Also, all the Rohingya people in Arakan State are very afraid, because the military comes and burns down their houses in the village. Some of them didn't leave the country. They built a hut, a small bamboo shed, and they lived there. However, now the government is trying to send them to those camps. What is the purpose?
These people are there. They should build a house. This is their land. They should stay there, but the government didn't allow that. They want to put them in the camps. This is saying that it's not honest.
We welcome the international governments for coming forward to help them, but we can't trust the Burmese government.
Liberal
Marwan Tabbara Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Do you feel hopeful now that other neighbouring states have mentioned that they are there to help the Rohingyas, or is there not much...?
Liberal
Director, Rohingya Association of Canada
If I may, I'll just add a few comments to what my colleague Ms. Arkani mentioned.
The plight of my people has happened for decades, as you are very well aware. Every time there is a massacre, after the massacre finishes you have what is called the “intermediate phase”, where human trafficking, sex trafficking and all these horrible things happen.
The boats that left are very much a product of human trafficking that happens through the jungles of Thailand and all the way into Malaysia. The people who left, they come from the intermittent camps—the IDP camps that are out there.
The 127,000 people Mr. Shwe Maung mentioned, which I also alluded to in my talk, have nowhere to escape. The moment those who are in the camps in Bangladesh hear that there is repatriation happening, they are trying to escape.
The very people who are in the boats.... It has been just three weeks since I finished some translations of interviews conducted by the Canadian Museum for Human Rights. I invite you all to attend the opening ceremony of the first-ever Rohingya exhibition, which will happen there. Some of the people who have been interviewed are in these trafficking camps. The survivors have talked about how, when they enter these boats, they are faced with the same Burmese authorities. It's the Burmese authorities who are doing this trafficking, and that is the product of it. There is no safety happening there.
Liberal
Liberal
Iqra Khalid Liberal Mississauga—Erin Mills, ON
Fantastic.
First, I want to echo the voice of my colleagues and thank you for your advocacy and for your courage in coming forward and speaking for those who don't have a voice right now. Really, thank you.
Ms. Arkani, you spoke about repatriation. We know that the Rohingya faced violence not only from the military but from local communities, their neighbours and friends within them. When you talk about repatriation, I think the challenge is not just coming back into a land and being accepted by the government; it's also being accepted by the people. Perhaps you can touch on how you think repatriation should actually be happening.
Second, Mr. Phan or Ms. Ullah, perhaps you can speak about other minorities who are also facing violence at the hands of the military. Do they also face violence from their neighbours in local communities?
Ms. Arkani, go ahead.
As an Individual
I left my country when I was 24 years old. I was raised there. I graduated over there, and only less than 1% do. I'm very lucky to have had that chance.
I have various friends. Actually, Burma is a very diverse country. We have various ethnicities. We go to school together, Christian and Nepali. It's a very beautiful country. The problem is racism. The government uses religion as a profit base. Whenever they want to do something, they use religion. They put religion in front of them and put hatred in people. I experienced hatred when I was young. Even my very close friends, Buddhist friends, used slurs towards us. I know they didn't mean it, but in the community it was happening like that. Even some religious figures would use hatred.
I would like to see peaceful reunification. Perhaps our government, the Canadian government, could provide some workshops over there on the peace process. That would bring people together. They don't hate each other. They just get used by the Burmese government. There is beauty at the core of people. You just can't see it because of all the hatred and racism.
Ms. Anita Vandenbeld (Ottawa West—Nepean, Lib.)
Actually, that's it for time. We might have a couple of minutes at the end to perhaps come back to that.
Next is Ms. Hardcastle.
NDP
Cheryl Hardcastle NDP Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
Thank you very much.
I'll get right to it so that we use our time wisely.
Yasmin, I remember when you came the last time and you didn't have an opportunity to speak. My understanding is that you came at your own expense because you felt so strongly about advocating. I can't tell you how inspiring that is.
Mr. Tinmaung said earlier that we need to take some concrete action, and that we want to make sure the conditions don't foster new extremist groups in the camps. I'm wondering what your thoughts are on that. Is it about concrete actions? How does that foster extremism? I'm maybe going back to some of the racism Zainab was talking about.
President, Rohingya Human Rights Network
We have been subjected to the kinds of conditions that have taught us we have to find a way to survive, however we can.
Most of the time, people in the refugee camps right now are in limbo. They don't know what their future might be. They don't know what they're going to eat tomorrow. At best, they will be able to eat rice once a day, rice that was perhaps brought from Burma, which is ironic in a way.
I hear heartbreaking stories from people reporting about it, that when young children fled from the massacre last year in Myanmar, the only thing they took with them was a book from the school they were not allowed to attend. These are the kinds of things the Rohingya would need: libraries, things that would keep us occupied and that would broaden our horizons and help us educate ourselves and be able to voice our concerns to the global community.
I believe that education has a lot of power, not only to stop radicalization but to broaden our ways of seeking provisions in general. We would be able to find more things to do and more ways to improve ourselves. That only comes under the condition that the Bangladeshi government would allow it, because they don't allow education further than grade 6, I believe. Mr. Tinmaung would probably be able to elaborate on that.
It's the same way we're dealt with in Burma. Most of our schools would be segregated from the rest of the Rakhine community. It probably echoes a lot of things that happened down south a few years back, before the civil rights movement. Segregation is happening in a way where the students are not only segregated in school depending on their race and ethnicity, but also taunted for being Rohingya. Sometimes teachers won't even show up at their school.
These children are stuck in limbo as well. They have nowhere to go. They don't know what else is out there waiting for them. I experienced a little of that when I was in Thailand as a refugee. I was illegal there. That was hard, because when you're not quite sure what your future might look like, it fosters this feeling of being a foreigner in this land, not able to achieve anything, not able to be successful.
I think generally that's how the Rohingya feel, that they're not given the kind of resources they would need to succeed. I think there are things we could do. There are things that $300 million could create, and those are opportunities.
NDP
Cheryl Hardcastle NDP Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
Do you think we should come out and very succinctly denounce the repatriation right now?