Evidence of meeting #26 for Subcommittee on International Human Rights in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was burundi.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Representative in Canada, Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees
In my subsequent reply to you, I might want to find out more what the situation per country is.
Conservative
David Sweet Conservative Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON
Thank you. Yes, we were on the Jordanian-Syrian border two years ago and we saw a substantial difference between camps. Some were very sophisticated with their own currency, and others were, how would I say, much more precarious.
October 20th, 2016 / 1:50 p.m.
Representative in Canada, Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees
Conservative
David Sweet Conservative Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON
That's a very unique situation there that most people aren't aware of, where the royal Jordanian border guards are actually supplying humanitarian aid as well as security, which is very complex as well.
Could you tell me if there is a place where our committee could find the ideal model for a camp? Here's what I'm getting at. Is there a per capita security quotient in a United Nations high commission refugee camp where you would say there would be one security personnel for a certain number of people? I'm asking this question particularly in regard to those vulnerable women we've heard about who have been raped in the camps and, of course, the youth.
Representative in Canada, Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees
In general terms again, in the way we manage camps, there are, indeed, all kinds of tools and procedures and schemes for certain sizes of camp, or complexities of different minorities or populations, and what they would require in terms of layout and from a protection and security point of view. There must be sufficient space in the camp to walk around, lighting at night, but when it comes to how many security personnel you need, these are normally things which are being negotiated in the individual situations. Again, I can get back to my headquarters and find out a bit more, and also, particularly in the Burundi situation in the camps, I can include that with my response to your previous question.
Conservative
David Sweet Conservative Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON
Thank you very much. I'll try and squeeze one question in here then.
You mentioned you only have 44% of the budget that you need to continue on in Burundi. When you make an appeal, do you make it to the general members of the United Nations, or do you target members who haven't committed what they should, per se?
Representative in Canada, Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees
Thank you for this question.
Again, I can speak out of my own experience. Such an appeal is published so it is for the community at large; however, the UNHCR always goes to a number of member states that have more leverage and have developed a privileged political relationship with the country to at least get their funds. But you also go to those states that don't have this type of relationship and that can be seen as much more neutral by the receiving community.
Again, and forgive me for digressing, but I used to be the humanitarian coordinator for Yemen, and I have just been out of Yemen in the last three years, so I've dealt with all this. You have the usual suspects among the donor community that have a political relationship with Yemen—and I won't mention the names now—but a country like Canada is, in that sense, seen as a neutral and very objective partner, and in that sense can be asked.... I know, for instance, in the Yemen situation, Canada has re-engaged because we reached out to Canada.
Since you have been funding the Great Lakes situation, I really hope you can continue to do it, not only for the UNHCR, but for the various humanitarian partners. If you have a specific interest in education, for instance, which the government has, then we can also look at UNICEF, international NGOs, and other partners that deal with education.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Michael Levitt
Thank you.
We have time for MP Khalid to ask a short question, but I want to give her an opportunity to ask it.
Liberal
Iqra Khalid Liberal Mississauga—Erin Mills, ON
Thank you very much, Chair.
Thank you, gentlemen, for coming in today to speak about this very important issue.
I recently had the opportunity to speak to the Canadian High Commission in Kenya, and I got to see first-hand the impact such a crisis has on geographical regions where the displacement of people affects the development of neighbouring countries as well. Whether they are willing to host or not, it does have a detrimental effect.
In my conversation with the high commission, I asked them what a proposed solution to this issue could be, and the African Union was mentioned.
I understand that Canada does play a bit of a role with the African Union with respect to development in that region, but I would like your comments on how Canada could play a role in having the African Union really have a political solution to this problem.
Representative in Canada, Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees
Yes, this is a wide-ranging question that goes a little bit beyond my mandate.
As you mentioned, often nowadays when there is a crisis on the continent, the regional bodies try to engage the African Union in a crisis. It's not only in Kenya, as you've mentioned, but Somalia for that matter, or Sudan, but sometimes you have a hybrid situation also in the UN force. It depends in the end on what the parties to a conflict agree to and what would be welcome.
In that sense, what could Canada do in such situations? There are relationships, of course, with the African Union. You have your representation in Addis Ababa, I assume. Your ambassador will discuss this, but if it comes to the wider question of how you can engage with the African Union, this is, in my view, something that has to be discussed case by case.
In the situation of Burundi, it was agreed that the African Union would send its military observers and its human rights monitors, but in addition the high commission has the right, and a specific investigation committee of inquiry on behalf of the UN would also be sent, so that would be a more hybrid situation.
However, I don't do justice to your question because it may be a separate discussion.
Liberal
Iqra Khalid Liberal Mississauga—Erin Mills, ON
I have a short comment.
We've heard a lot of testimony about what Canada can do and, because we do have a very minimal role, it's a very difficult issue. Providing monetary contributions to refugee camps in that region help in the short term, but I find that if we don't find a long-term solution, then any monetary contribution is ineffective, and it doesn't really help to solve the problem.
Thank you very much.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Michael Levitt
With that I want to thank our guests for joining us here today, and thank you, Mr. Van Der Klaauw, for providing the testimony.
We are seized with this issue, especially given the escalation of the situation over recent weeks and months in Burundi, and I thank you very much for your efforts in attending here with us today.
Representative in Canada, Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees
Thank you very much.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Michael Levitt
There were a couple of things that you were going to follow up on. If you wouldn't mind sending those to the clerk, she can distribute them to the committee.
Representative in Canada, Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees
Will do.