Evidence of meeting #26 for Subcommittee on International Human Rights in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was regime.
A video is available from Parliament.
1:45 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Before we continue, I'd like us to address the interpretation issue. I let it go this time because it's an important issue, but I want to get it resolved before we move on to the next round of questions.
Thank you.
1:45 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sameer Zuberi
You're welcome.
We're going to monitor this and fix it.
We're going to continue for the next six minutes with Ms. McPherson.
1:45 p.m.
Bloc
1:45 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
What I'd like is for us to fix the interpretation issue and then start the next round of questions, not start the next round of questions and then fix the interpretation issue.
1:45 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sameer Zuberi
Mr. Brunelle‑Duceppe, can you keep talking for a while?
We're just taking care of this.
1:45 p.m.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Yes, I can certainly do that. I can recite a nursery rhyme, if you like. Perhaps it will lighten the mood.
One, two, buckle my shoe
Three, four, knock at the door
Five, six, pick up sticks
Is it working now?
1:45 p.m.
Liberal
Anita Vandenbeld Liberal Ottawa West—Nepean, ON
I just wanted to say it's been working fine on our side and for the staff as well.
1:45 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sameer Zuberi
That's great. We're going to continue. I'm happy that it's been taken care of. We don't want to take away from the testimony, so let's get into it.
Go ahead, Ms. McPherson, please, for six minutes.
1:45 p.m.
NDP
Heather McPherson NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Thank you to all of our witnesses. I wish I could be with you in person today as we talk about this very important issue.
You know, obviously, we are seeing the gender apartheid happening in Iran. I represent Edmonton Strathcona where many victims from PS752 resided, but I want to start by taking a moment to just say something about the Iranian Canadians and the Iranian community outside of Iran, who have been just so incredible in fighting for the rights of Iranian women. The protests and the constant bringing of this forward, I think, are the reason we're studying this here and the reason this issue has become so important to so many people across the country. Thank you to everyone who has participated in that movement.
For us as a subcommittee of the foreign affairs committee, the goal now is to look at what things Canada can do to help the women of Iran, the people of Iran, to deal with their murderous regime.
I know, Ms. Gonzalez Mencken, you spoke about the feminist foreign policy. This is a huge issue, something I've raised many times. We've been told by the government that they in fact have in effect a feminist foreign policy but that it is not written down. It is not public. It is not something that is shared.
How important is it that this feminist foreign policy actually be articulated, actually be written down and actually be shared with Canadians and with people around the world?
1:45 p.m.
Co-Vice President, Global Programs, Equality Fund
Thank you for that question.
I would say that it's extremely important. In our first recommendation here, we lifted up how that feminist foreign policy has to be published and shared, and it has to have a coherence and an articulation of all of the different tools and policies that can also make a difference in its implementation. As one of the witnesses was saying here today—Professor, thank you for that comment—there has to be a coherence between what our international assistance does and what our foreign policy does. It's all part and parcel of achieving the goals that we have and supporting the groups around the world that are doing this work.
It's extremely important that it be published, that it be shared and that it have all of the tools that can bring that coherence and action.
1:45 p.m.
NDP
Heather McPherson NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB
Thank you.
Also what it does is it provides leadership for other countries, for them to consider having a feminist foreign policy.
I really appreciate what you said about the idea that our development and our foreign policy must be aligned. In fact, I think our international development is a fundamental pillar of our foreign policy that needs to be used when we look at our defence, our peace and security, and our diplomacy.
Ms. Hoodfar, could you please comment on that as well? Perhaps talk a little about the need for the support, the funding and whatnot, to align with the feminist foreign policy. What does it mean to actually have predictable, long-term, flexible funding included in that?
1:50 p.m.
Professor of Anthropology, Emerita, Women Living Under Muslim Laws
That is quite important. Thank you for bringing that to the discussion.
A lot of times you get a project where its two years, three years or four years. These four-year projects are not going to deliver very much in terms of human rights. You have to have at least a 20-year policy that you dish out in a smaller but coherent way, so that we see the results at the end.
Those are very important. Also, there's combining economic supports with human rights issues, especially the rights of minorities, whether they're sexual minorities, religious minorities or racial minorities. Those are very important issues. In different countries those tend to be the most excluded groups of people. If you can protect their human rights, you can basically protect everybody else's human rights.
Often, not just in Canada but elsewhere, in the development project we separate human rights as politics and development as economic development, while these two should be hand in hand. They work together better if they are combined and in coherence with one another.
That's what we really wish to see in Canada to set an example for the rest of the feminist governments.
1:50 p.m.
NDP
Heather McPherson NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB
Thank you. I would like to follow up on that.
You talked about the difference between having our human rights in one bowl and our development in another bowl. What I found is that we also have our trade in a different bowl. Unfortunately, we often prioritize trade over these other things like human rights and international development.
Perhaps you could comment on that.
1:50 p.m.
Professor of Anthropology, Emerita, Women Living Under Muslim Laws
As I said, the combination of these all together, and I used the example of the bird, unless we get them together, we won't reach the results we want to have.
I hope we can come together and coordinate this policy. Thank you.
1:50 p.m.
NDP
Heather McPherson NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB
Thank you very much.
I admire you very much for all of the work that you do.
1:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sameer Zuberi
Thank you, Ms. McPherson.
We will now continue to our final round of two minutes each.
We will start with Ms. Vandenbeld.
1:50 p.m.
Liberal
Anita Vandenbeld Liberal Ottawa West—Nepean, ON
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to direct my question to the Equality Fund.
I know that you have a unique mechanism, particularly because of how directly you support women on the ground—activists, human rights defenders—around the world. That gives you a unique perspective and also intel that's coming back to you.
One of the things you mentioned in your remarks was our human rights defenders stream. I'm very proud that came out of a recommendation, a report from this committee, to have a stream of immigration specifically for human rights defenders. I'm wondering if you could elaborate on how you would see that being expanded, not just in numbers—I would be so bold as to say I'd go even further than the numbers you were suggesting; we need to do this at scale—but also in the mechanism.
We know that human rights defenders often are not like other asylum seekers. They want to stay in their country. They want to return the moment it's safe, but they also have more urgency. When they need to get out, they need to get out now.
Is there a mechanism that you would see where, rather than being part of the asylum program, this would be a separate stream that would specifically target human rights defenders? What would that look like?
1:50 p.m.
Co-Vice President, Global Programs, Equality Fund
Thank you so much for your question.
What we hear from human rights defenders is that they need that protection quickly when they need to leave, but that in itself is not sustainable. A mechanism as we recommended would also look at what supports are in place when those human rights defenders are part of, in the case of Iran for example, the diaspora. Can they continue doing their human rights defence? Can they continue to be in connection with others doing this work?
If those supports are not in place and that networking is not happening, then those who wanted them silenced and out of the country in the first place almost win. That's really important to take into account.
1:55 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sameer Zuberi
Thank you.
We're going to continue to our next round with Mr. Aboultaif for two minutes, please.
1:55 p.m.
Conservative
Ziad Aboultaif Conservative Edmonton Manning, AB
Thanks to the witnesses.
Mr. Shahrooz, thanks for appearing, among others.
The world's changing around us quite a bit. Everything we believe in is happening now, and we never thought it would happen, especially when it comes to Iran, Afghanistan and other places. There's China, for example, and so forth.
Are we up to the task in Canada to deal with such a human rights violation, especially against women and girls?
What can we do? If we are to set priorities, what can we do to make sure that we will be effective, rather than continuing to make those studies without any action plan that we know is going to make a difference?
1:55 p.m.
Lawyer & Senior Fellow, Macdonald-Laurier Institute, As an Individual
That's an excellent question, sir.
I think there is a lot we can do. We are a middle power, but we're an important one and we have played this role before. I alluded to the really important role Canada played with respect to apartheid in South Africa. I think we ought to adopt the same plays from the same playbook.
Iran's apartheid regime needs to be isolated diplomatically, and we need to provide maximum support to the Iranian people to help overthrow their regime. That means many things. It means that we have to use our relationships with our like-minded countries, with our allies, to bring pressure to bear on the Iranian regime. It means we must, here in Canada, list the IRGC as a terrorist group, carving out people who were forced to serve as conscripts.
Just a minute ago, there was discussion about the human rights defenders stream. We really need to open our doors to human rights defenders who are languishing. In the last few days, I've been hearing many really troubling stories from human rights defenders who are stranded in Turkey and Iraq and want to come to this country.
These are actual, tangible ways we can help the revolution in Iran.
1:55 p.m.
Conservative
Ziad Aboultaif Conservative Edmonton Manning, AB
Yes, there's no unified front on Iran, as far as the western world is concerned. Canada is not at the same level as our allies.
Would any of the witnesses like to comment on that?