I have talked to some of you as individuals and some of you were in Tokyo. At a conference, I talked to you as individuals and friends and whatever. To me, the current negotiations are with Japan and Europe—and I've advised various people in Ottawa.
Picking up on Michael's point, Simon Reisman was our negotiator, but inside the negotiating team—the American and Canadian—we had people on both sides who would engage on the political pitfalls for both countries of certain issues. We would meet regularly. We had a cabinet committee, chaired by Mike Wilson, and it was cabinet secrecy so you know....
Australia is the country pushing the most for the secrecy. Australia was against Canada's coming in initially and against Japan's. Unfortunately, we were basically the last country to approve Japan. But the private sector is fundamentally at this stage interested in two agreements, with Europe and Japan, because they know the practical political pitfalls of the TPP and some of these other agreements.
Some of these other agreements may be retail, but they're trivial. They don't amount to much. Trade with some of these countries, as I wrote in an article, is like a day's trade with the United States or three days or a week with Japan.
Concentrate on a limited number of issues, with a limited number of negotiators on the two big issues. The Europeans, by the way, would love a deal with us, as a prelude for negotiating with the Americans.