International Trade Committee on Feb. 3rd, 2014

[Dr. Bruce Banman]

I had a brief discussion with Minister Fast. First off, the big question was how did I get picked for this? He said, “I have no idea. I was away.”

But I have also read the FCM statement and it is overwhelmingly positive from what I've seen. Again, there are going to be a couple of nitpicky things I'm sure we can focus on, but I think it's important to look at the overall picture. When we only have one major trading partner, diversification is in our best interests long term. Especially when I take a look at how many more times we are going to come to a fiscal cliff that we have to jump off before things actually do go sideways. We need to diversify our market share.

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

Fantastic. I agree with that.

One quick question, Mr. Tam, coming from the Okanagan, innovation technology is a big hub. Working with our Okanagan College and UBC Okanagan, we see the great opportunities. How do you get your members engaged and excited about CETA and show them the opportunities?

That's one of the reasons why we're out here, trying to spread the word and the opportunities. What are you proposing to do within the association and how can we help?

[Bill Tam]

First of all I want to commend Jeff Keen and our colleagues at Accelerate Okanagan for the terrific sort of environment that they create there.

I think it's an education process that as associations we need to undertake in conjunction with government. Within our spectre, the obvious place for companies to go is the U.S. and the European agreement allows us to offer up new opportunities.

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

I look forward to working together. Thank you. Jeff is a hard worker and doing great work. Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Thank you very much.

We are going into our second round. We have two questioners with five minutes each, Mr. Sandhu followed by Mr. Holder.

[Jasbir Sandhu, NDP, Surrey North, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I too want to be on the record as saying that Surrey is actually one of the best cities to live in. It is the fastest-growing city. We will pass the population of Vancouver by 2030.

Along with that I do want to mention that I picked berries in Abbotsford back in the 1980s, so I am very much interested in having berries exported to other countries.

Mr. Banman, are you familiar with the trade commissioner services overseas?

[Dr. Bruce Banman]

No, I am not familiar with that, to be honest with you. Perhaps I am but in a different way, but not by that particular title.

[Jasbir Sandhu, NDP, Surrey North, BC]

Trade commissioners are Canadian-based specialists who serve our exporters in the embassies to identify intelligence about local markets and stuff. Do you think a resource like that would help farmers out in the valley?

[Dr. Bruce Banman]

Absolutely I think it would. Overwhelmingly though I really think, whether we want to admit it or not, the world is becoming a much smaller place. It is easy to import and export jobs for a number of reasons. I think that one of the things that has to be taken into consideration is how competitive you are. Tariffs to protect one's own industry I don't think are wise.

I'll go to the wine industry in the Okanagan. I remember back in the day Harry McWatters, who is actually a good personal friend of mine, started the micro-industry in wines. We had protected that industry and they had produced horrible wine, to be blunt. Now we have some of the best wines in the world. We compete internationally and I believe that all they want is a chance to free up the ability to infiltrate those markets. We are internationally renowned and that's what happens when you allow industries to flourish and set them free.

[Jasbir Sandhu, NDP, Surrey North, BC]

My colleagues asked earlier on about the dairy industry in the Fraser Valley. I wasn't quite sure what the response was that we got from you. Are the dairy farmers being heard, or are they going to benefit from this EU trade agreement?

[Dr. Bruce Banman]

My understanding, having talked to them, is it is going to be pretty much a wash. While the cheeses will be inboard competitive, it's not going to actually hurt the dairy farms themselves. If anything, that may have an impact upon the big producers, such as Saputo for instance in Abbotsford, that actually make the cheese.

I think the flip of us sending Canadian cheddar abroad—I don't think we can keep the orange dye in it but there will be a white cheddar that's sent aboard—and other things will actually force us to be more innovative and infiltrate those markets. Again, my understanding from talking to local producers is the rules of supply management are stopping them from getting into those other markets because they have a quota that they can produce. They're penalized if they produce over their quota.

So if we're able to take that extra product and use that for export, I think that they'll win. The market has been flat as I understand for about the last 20 years, according to the dairy farmers I've talked to.

[Jasbir Sandhu, NDP, Surrey North, BC]

Mr. Tam, we've seen a large deficit in manufactured goods that we export to Europe. In fact most of the goods that we export to Europe currently are either agriculture goods or not processed products. Do you think your industry will benefit from having this agreement in place, that it will increase our manufactured goods to the European Union?

[Bill Tam]

I think the manufacturing sector in technology has been pretty static over the last ten years. I see the opportunity for us in the export market is really more around services in software and soft goods. I think there is no doubt that it will help to spur on more competitiveness in our manufacturing sector, but I think the nature of our industry sector is much more geared towards soft goods.

[Jasbir Sandhu, NDP, Surrey North, BC]

Mr. Banman, you mentioned that there will some winners and losers, and we talked about some of the winners. Who are some of the losers in your city?

[Dr. Bruce Banman]

To be honest I don't know. Whenever you change policies like this, it's inevitable. I think what you want to do is make sure that it's balanced and you put yourself in a better position. From what I've seen from my area of the world, that's definitely going to put us in a much better position. I've talked to manufacturing. Abbotsford is a very diverse economy. I talked to manufacturing and the high tech section here; there are those who say the benefits outweigh the risks.

As a chiropractor I deal with that all the time. I tell patients all the time that there are risks to care and there are benefits to care. What you have to do is to make sure that the balance overall is worth the risk. From what I've seen and heard, the vast majority feel that the benefits outweigh any risks.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Holder, you have five minutes.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'd like to thank our guests for being here today. I've decided I now love every city and town in beautiful British Columbia—it's just the safest approach I think—there isn't one city that isn't a postcard. So compliments to you, mayor, and to preceding mayors and colleagues from other parts of British Columbia, and my colleagues opposite.

I'm really disappointed Mr. Sandhu is leaving our committee because—as your role as a berry picker and understanding the importance of picking berries in Abbotsford—I think you were one berry away from supporting this agreement. So it is a little disappointing.

You know, it's rather interesting. Canada has a population, mayor and Mr. Tam, of some 34 million people. We talk about the 500 million people in the European Union. That can either be an opportunity or a threat. I heard a colleague opposite talk about the 500 million as a potential threat because those are the folks potentially coming to Canada who could be competing with us. Mr. Tam, you talked about the services. Are you afraid of Canada's competition from a service standpoint into the EU?

[Bill Tam]

Not at all. I think, if anything, it affords us the opportunity to build scale. Scale is what matters to be competitive in the tech sector. It's an area that we've taken advantage of in the U.S., but as Bruce has stated eloquently it's by diversifying the markets with equivalent scale that we grow better companies.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

I'm not sure. Do we call citizens of Abbotsford, Abbotsfordians? What do you call them?

[Dr. Bruce Banman]

You know what? I would encourage you to come for a visit and then you can learn all about it. But it doesn't really matter. Abbotsfordians works just fine.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

Well, the fine people of Abbotsford, would you be concerned about their ability to compete against the market of 500 million people of the European Union?

[Dr. Bruce Banman]

I take a look at the recent statistics that came out from the school board. We are in among the top 10 educated cities in Canada, or at least my area is. I can't speak for all of Canada. So, no, I say, “Bring it on”.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

In the spirit of that, the proceeding questioner, my friend, Mr. Sandhu, asked a question about where the losers are. I want to give you some comfort, gentlemen. We just this past week had the European Union ambassador to Canada in front of this committee who was asked that very question: who are the losers? Obviously, if there are winners, who are the losers? She said emphatically, on behalf of Canada, there were no losers.

I think what I hear from both of you is that the spirit of trade makes it such that the consumer's the winner because of the potential for better pricing, and high-skilled labour is the winner because we have the opportunity to put that forward and show what we can do worldwide. What I've heard from both of you is that you're not afraid to compete.

Mr. Tam, you talked about your innovation hub as being an example of where those things just work, that they are the basis on which innovation companies and start-ups have a place to go. Do you think, in conjunction with how we can compete in Europe, that's part of the future, those types of hubs?

[Bill Tam]

Absolutely, because it's a coalescing point. First, it's for multinationals to actually get a glimpse. It's much easier when you have a hub. You can actually take them around to the companies fairly easily, in terms of the things that they might be interested in. Second, it provides an education foundation, where we can actually help with their ability to understand what it means to be in export markets, how to grow something competitive globally.

To your earlier comment, the nature of technology—and having been an entrepreneur for the last 15 years—is about failure, and it's from that failure that we breed success.

So I think, in the end, this is a win situation for everyone involved.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

So Mayor Banman, in the spirit of “Bring it on”—that's the quote—