International Trade Committee on Oct. 16th, 2018

[Peter Fonseca, Liberal, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

That's what we've been hearing, that the landscape continues to change on them, day to day, week to week, month to month. As this is going along through your ministry and your team, do you continue to consult with stakeholders? Is this being done on a daily basis?

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Yes.

[Peter Fonseca, Liberal, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

And that is so important because, as they told us, these things are changing on them. The suite of services of support that have been put in place, so the remission orders, the loans from BDC and EDC.... We heard about the extended work-sharing agreements, also the strategic innovation fund. Many of those are working. For those that have put in requests, how can they continue to touch base with the ministry? Often they may feel that they want to know where the process is at. We heard that 50 have been approved, I believe.

What was the number? How many had submitted?

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

One hundred and thirty-five.

[Peter Fonseca, Liberal, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

One hundred and thirty-five. For those who are still working through the process, and as they are being reviewed, how do they stay in touch with the ministry and know where their file is at?

[Patrick Halley]

It is very much an ongoing process. It's an ongoing dialogue with the companies that request that. Also, as I mentioned, during the consultation with some of the producers with respect to their supply situation, it's an ongoing dialogue with them as well. For most of their requests, we're very much in touch and there's a lot of back and forth with the companies, so they know where it's at in the process. Of course, at some point there's a cabinet process to approve the order in council that went forward last week where no information can be provided, but in terms of the assessment this is very much a back-and-forth exercise.

[Peter Fonseca, Liberal, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

Thank you.

Another thing that came up was around looking at a quota system. We've heard from some who would maybe be in favour and look at the advantages of that. However, some saw it as a disadvantage and that it wouldn't work.

Can you speak to if there weren't the tariffs, if we had a quota system, and that came into place?

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

What I think we've talked about is that we are in dialogue with our U.S. counterparts. I had the chance to meet last week with the Secretary of the Treasury, Steven Mnuchin, to talk about this issue. I know that my colleague Chrystia Freeland is in communications with the United States Trade Representative. The goal is to move away from the current situation.

We're not going to negotiate in public, in terms of the approach we're trying to take.

Our objectives would be the best way to start. We want to make sure that the market is stable. We want to make sure that we don't have harm to either our steel industry or to the users of steel. It's getting that balance, which is the objective. Clearly we want to move away from the current situation.

As for the mechanism to do that, we're not at a stage where we're able to be talking about it, because it's not close to being done.

[Peter Fonseca, Liberal, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

That pretty well wraps up your time.

We're going to move over to the Conservatives.

Mr. Carrie, you have the floor.

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

Thank you, Minister.

This is a dire situation. Businesses in front of us need some straight answers, so I am wondering if you could answer this question with a yes or a no.

Have you received assurances that the tariffs on Canadian aluminum and steel would be lifted?

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Again, we are working together with our American counterparts. I'm cautiously optimistic that progress is being made, but we need to continue in that discussion in order to get us to a conclusion that meets our objectives.

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

Respectfully, Minister, today you're talking about processes, and the businesses in front of us are talking about keeping their doors open. They're talking about maybe leaving Canada. They're very patriotic companies that want to stay here, but because of the situation they may have to leave. They may not share your optimism.

You're saying there are no assurances that these will even be lifted. Is that what you're telling us?

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Maybe I can step back.

We were not the ones to put in place this section 232. We are responding to what we think is an unjust action by the U.S. government. We're responding in a way that allows us, at one point, at one stage, to obviously do the negotiations and behind the scene make sure we are trying to deal with the issues around keeping the market stable and the issues of downstream users.

I'll acknowledge that this is a situation that we don't want to be in. We don't want businesses to be in this situation. That's the reason we've taken extraordinary action around safeguards, remissions and offers, and put in place a duties relief program, so that people who are clearly fabricating steel coming from the United States and sending it back....

There are multiple things going on that are, in our estimation, what we should be doing in the face of what we think is an unjust action.

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

I think we can agree with that, but respectfully, Minister, we have kind of negotiated away all our leverage. We've signed an agreement.

The companies in front of us need to make business decisions. You mentioned the program you have in front of these companies. We've heard today—and I'll echo what my colleagues have said—that this is an emergency situation.

These businesses are making decisions now. They can't last another four months. The program you have in front of them, frankly, is broken; it's not working.

What I'm relaying to you, because obviously you're not getting the message, is that it is an emergency situation for our manufacturing sector. If they lose these jobs, they're not coming back. They will not come back.

The program you have is not effective. It is not working.

Can you give us details of what you're going to put forward over the next few months so that we don't lose these businesses? Can you give us those details?

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

We actually see that the measures we've put in place are having a significant impact. I think it's fair—

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

From who, Minister? Who are you hearing from that this is actually working?

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Again, there are 189 clients who have authorized loans from the BDC. There are 24 clients who have authorized—

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

They said loans don't work, Minister. They're saying the loans are not working. They can get loans. They can go to the bank. They're in a financial situation. They can get the loans, but they need relief and they need immediate relief, sir. This is an urgent situation. We're sitting with CEOs of companies who are telling us how urgent this is, and they need relief now. I was wondering if you could detail what you're going to be doing to give them the relief now, so we don't lose those businesses.

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

I'm pleased to continue detailing what we're doing. By putting in place loan programs that are demonstrably working for a significant number of companies that have taken them up; by putting in place duties relief programs that a significant number of companies are using—

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

Can you—

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

Mr. Carrie, just give him some breathing room to finish his answer.

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

I only have five minutes though, Chair. I don't want to waste my five minutes.

[Bill Morneau, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

I think the rule is that I can speak as long as the person who asks the question. Is that—

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

I'll just remind MPs, and the minister, to keep your questions short and let the minister finish his answer. I think you'll get more information.

Go ahead, Minister.