Evidence of meeting #4 for International Trade in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was pandemic.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Sara Wilshaw  Chief Trade Commissioner, Assistant Deputy Minister, International Business Development, Investment and Innovation, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development
Steve Verheul  Assistant Deputy Minister, Trade Policy and Negotiations and Chief Trade Negotiator of the Canada-United States-Mexico Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development
Clerk of the Committee  Ms. Christine Lafrance

3:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair (Hon. Judy A. Sgro (Humber River—Black Creek, Lib.)) Liberal Judy Sgro

I call to order this meeting of the Standing Committee on International Trade, 43rd Parliament, second session, meeting number four. Pursuant to Standing Order 81(4), we are meeting on the main estimates 2020-21: vote 1 under Invest in Canada Hub, referred to the committee on Wednesday, September 30.

Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format pursuant to the House order of September 23, 2020. The proceedings are available via the House of Commons website. To ensure an orderly meeting, I would like to outline a few rules to follow.

Members and witnesses may speak in the official language of their choice. Interpretation services are available for this meeting. You have a choice at the bottom of your screen of floor, English or French.

For members participating in person, proceed as you usually would when the whole committee is meeting in person in a committee room. Keep in mind the directives from the Board of Internal Economy regarding masking and health protocols for everyone.

Before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. If you are on the video conference, please click on the microphone icon to unmute your mike. For those in the room, your microphone will be controlled as normal by the proceedings and verification officer. I will remind you that all comments by members and witnesses need to be addressed through the chair. When you are not speaking, your mike should be on mute.

Pursuant to that standing order, I would like to welcome Minister Ng, Minister of Small Business, Export Promotion and International Trade, and her officials. Minister Ng will be here for one hour and her officials will remain for the second hour.

Minister Ng, welcome to our committee. Thank you for being here. I turn the floor over to you.

3:35 p.m.

Markham—Thornhill Ontario

Liberal

Mary Ng LiberalMinister of Small Business

Thank you so much.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Good afternoon, everyone, vice-chairs and all the members of the committee.

It's an absolute pleasure to be with you and to assist the committee in its important work. It's an honour to speak to Canadians.

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to kill two birds with one stone.

Coronavirus, pandemic, shutdown, mask up, test and trace, once-in-a-generation crisis: A year ago, if these words resonated at all with Canadians, it would have been as far-fetched plots from sci-fi films or from books. Today, however, they are words that we would use if we were asked to write the opening chapter of Canada's COVID-19 story. I know that my version of this chapter would acknowledge how extraordinarily difficult these last eight months have been for Canadians. During this time, I have been across the country, mostly virtually, and have spoken to thousands of Canadians, so many of whom are business owners and entrepreneurs, whose lives and livelihoods have been turned upside down by this crisis.

Canadians have shown all of us time and again that they are incredibly resilient, hard-working and innovative, but many worry about what comes next, and that is understandable.

Madam Chair, I'll repeat what our government has been telling Canadians since the start of the pandemic.

We will be with you every step of the way. The best way for us to get through the challenges we face is by facing them together as team Canada. That is what we have done together since day one, and this is what we will continue to do.

From the beginning, we've focused on providing economic support to Canadians, while taking the necessary action to protect their health.

The result is that Canada's COVID-19 economic response plan has helped protect millions of jobs across Canada, provided emergency support to families and kept the lights on for businesses with lending support and the wage subsidy.

Just yesterday, we tabled legislation that will expand and extend the Canada emergency wage subsidy and launch the new Canada emergency rent subsidy. Both programs will support businesses across the country and continue to help Canadians throughout this crisis.

The pandemic also reminded us in stark terms how our world is truly interconnected. It has underscored the absolute importance of international collaboration and co-operation. However, as COVID-19 swept the world, many countries responded by restricting trade, the linchpin of prosperity for so many national economies. As of June, some 97 countries had responded to the pandemic by implementing more than 200 restrictions on cross-border trade. As of last month, 142 of those restrictions remain in place.

This isn't the right path, especially for a nation such as Canada that relies on trade.

Trade accounts for nearly two-thirds of Canada's economy and supports 3.3 million jobs, or one out of every six. COVID-19 should not and cannot be used as an excuse to stop trading or to turn inward with protectionist policies. Instead, we need to focus on the fundamentals: open trade and investment, diversify our trade and develop solutions to supply chain challenges. That is what we have done.

We have worked with Canadian exporters to find innovative solutions.

We worked with our international partners to remove unnecessary trade barriers and to keep the supply chain open and strong for essentials such as food and drugs.

Throughout the pandemic, for example, I've been working closely with my international partners from the G20, the WTO, APEC and others to ensure that our supply chains remain open, our businesses continue their work and crucial goods and services flow. Through Canada's leadership of the Ottawa Group on WTO reform, we're helping shape the future of multilateral rules-based trade, which is really key to global prosperity. It's this type of global co-operation that is going to see us rise to and overcome COVID-19.

Given the importance of international trade to Canada's economy, it's clear that exporting, importing and attracting investment from around the world will be critical to our ongoing recovery. However, it's not quite business as usual. The pandemic has forced us to adapt in innovative ways that are redefining how international trade can be done. Consider the virtual trade mission to South Korea that I am thrilled to be leading this week, in fact, starting tonight. More than 140 Canadian small businesses are signed up to participate in this groundbreaking endeavour. Many more would have joined us in a physical trade mission.

Our government is adapting our services to better serve Canadian businesses. This morning, the Prime Minister and I announced the revamping of the CanExport SME program. It's delivered by the trade commissioner service. This program gives our resilient and innovative small businesses grants of up to $75,000 to grow their businesses in the international market. Now, this funding will help them navigate a COVID-19 landscape, with funding to expand their digital and e-commerce presence and participate in virtual trade missions and virtual trade shows. This new world of digital international trade will continue to allow Canadian businesses to take advantage of Canada's preferential trade agreements. We have 14 of them. It gives us priority access to two-thirds of the global economy and to 1.5 billion customers.

To better leverage agreements such as the CPTPP and CETA, Global Affairs Canada is currently rolling out a concerted promotion strategy, with a sector-focused approach to increase awareness of these ambitious trade agreements.

We're ensuring that our businesses and workers in all parts of the country truly benefit from the opportunities being created in rapidly growing markets around the world.

To do that, we're taking a team Canada approach, an approach under the umbrella of Canada trade. This is what I call our trade tool box, which falls under my mandate. The tools in this tool box include the Canadian trade commissioner service. It includes Export Development Canada, or EDC, Business Development Canada, or BDC, the Canadian Commercial Corporation and Invest in Canada. We're all working together to help our businesses succeed here at home and abroad.

During my recent meeting with my provincial and territorial counterparts, we understood that if Canada is going to get through this difficult period, it will be key for all of us to mobilize small businesses and businesses of all sizes so that we can support their efforts to access the international market. It's equally key that in this mobilization, we include people of all backgrounds and diverse identities, including women, indigenous people, visible minorities, young people and LGBTQ2 entrepreneurs.

Diversifying trade is about more than where we trade and what we trade. It's about who trades. It's about supporting and encouraging new exporters, whether they're just starting out or they've never exported before. It's about being inclusive, because we know that trade works best when it benefits all Canadians, whether it's in traditional sectors such as natural resources and agri-foods or emerging sectors such as artificial intelligence or health technology.

As we move through this pandemic and build a path to a strong economic recovery for Canadians, I know that words such as “inclusive”, “innovative”, “resilient”, “collaborative” and “adaptable” will be among those used to describe how we have performed. These words are at the heart of what team Canada is really about: coming together to build on economic prosperity for our businesses of all sizes and to improve the quality of life for families and all Canadians.

I'd be happy to answer any questions that the committee has for me.

Thank you.

3:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Judy Sgro

Thank you very much, Ms. Ng.

I'd like to acknowledge the officials who are also with you today. From the Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development, we have John Hannaford, deputy minister, international trade; Steve Verheul, assistant deputy minister, trade policy and negotiations and chief trade negotiator of the Canada-United States-Mexico Agreement; Anick Ouellette, assistant deputy minister and chief financial officer, corporate planning, finance and information technology; and Sara Wilshaw, chief trade commissioner, assistant deputy minister, international business development, investment and innovation. Welcome to all of you.

We will move right away into questions.

Ms. Gray, you have six minutes, please.

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for being here. This is the first time you've been in front of this committee in over a year, during this Parliament. It's good to see you. I know that we only have you for an hour today. We are starting the Canada-U.K. study shortly, so I'm hoping that you will commit with us today to come back when we're having that study.

3:40 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

Of course, Ms. Gray, I would always be happy to come back and talk to my parliamentary colleagues.

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC

Great. Thank you, Minister.

I heard through Export Development Canada that they were instructed not to pay the government the yearly dividend this year as is obligated for Crown corporations. Would you say that was accurate for this year?

3:40 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

Ms. Gray, thank you so much for that.

Perhaps, on this one, I'm going to ask my deputy if he would respond, please.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC

Minister, if it's okay, because I know that we have the officials here a little bit later and because your time is limited today, I'll just move on. We can address that later. This is your department, and surely it would have been you or, if not you, someone else who would have given this direction. If you're not sure about that, it's a little concerning, but I'll move on to another question here.

I want to ask you about customs brokers. I know that the government implemented a customs broker deferral program as part of the pandemic plan. As part of this, customs brokers have to take out bonds for businesses. This is both for importing and exporting. I'm wondering if you're aware of this issue and have done any analysis on the customs broker deferral program.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

Ms. Gray, that's a terrific question.

Of course, that is a key function that is performed by Export Development Canada. Throughout this pandemic, what we have endeavoured to do is make sure that we are looking at the range of programs and services, including lending services for businesses so that they can indeed be supported throughout this pandemic. It's work that is ongoing, and we'll keep doing what we need to do to support Canada's exporters.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC

Thank you, Minister.

As part of this, there might be unintended financial consequences for these brokers because they're being asked to take on the bonds without remittance due to the deferrals. Are you working on any plans to rectify this? Do you have a plan that you're working on?

As we look at these customs brokers, we see that they do play a significant role in ensuring that our supply chains are moving and remain open. There's a concern that as these brokers are taking on more risk, they're getting to a point where potentially they might not be able to continue. Do you have a plan to address this? Are you working on a plan to address this?

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

I am very happy to always look at measures that will help Canadian businesses. Certainly, businesses that are working through the disruptions in the supply chains in the global economy are something that is absolutely top of mind for all of my officials. It's what I call our team Canada approach.

Throughout this pandemic, we have worked steadfastly to make sure that all of the tools that we have here are lined up in a way to help our businesses through this. I can't underscore enough the supply chain challenges that have taken place. Our chief trade commissioner is here. Throughout this time period they have done enormous work, for which I thank them enormously, to help unclog some of those very issues and supply chain challenges that our exporters have been facing. This is work that we're just going to continue to do.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC

Are you working on a plan right now for this issue specifically?

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

We're working on a plan overall to help our businesses and exporters make sure they are continuing to trade across the world. Whether the businesses are here or whether they are across the board, we continue to work on a plan to always help our businesses through this.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC

Okay.

I want to ask about the Invest in Canada Hub. Do you have a dollar value of foreign direct investments from businesses that would directly attribute to the Invest in Canada Hub, looking at the main estimates and the budget that was allocated for that? Do you have an amount for what was invested based on what we invested in this?

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

That's a terrific question.

Invest in Canada is such an important entity to help our Canadian businesses. It's the very first time there is a single-window mechanism to help investors who are looking to invest in Canadian businesses and here in Canada. The work they have done is terrific. Since Invest in Canada has been in place, we have absolutely seen an increase in FDI to the country. This a direct result of their work and their work in collaboration with the trade Canada team. That tool box, Invest in Canada, is a very important feature of that.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC

Thank you, Minister, for that high-level description, but I'm looking for the dollar value.

How many jobs were created from this? What is the dollar value in investment? Do you know what those numbers are?

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

In fact, $67 billion were invested last year in Canada through the work of the Invest in Canada Hub.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Tracy Gray Conservative Kelowna—Lake Country, BC

Could we get that tabled?

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Judy Sgro

Thank you very much, Mrs. Gray.

Yes. Thank you.

We'll go to Mr. Arya, for six minutes.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Chandra Arya Liberal Nepean, ON

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Minister and officials, welcome to the committee.

As we all know, Minister, this COVID pandemic has hit the reset button in almost every single country in the world. For Canada, trade is very important. Sixty per cent of our GDP comes from trade. It is not only international trade being affected now. We are expecting that it is going to continue to be detrimental to the old way that trade was being done. One reason may be the increasing importance of self-reliance, not only for Canada, but for many other countries. That may bring in some protectionist measures in different countries. The full parameter is changing. We are entering a new normal in terms of international trade. I think we have to take steps to see how we can help Canadian businesses continue to export outside of the North American market. That is the key thing.

You mentioned EDC, BDC and Canadian Commercial Corporation. It is good the funding is available, but I think we'll have to go down. For example, for Export Development Corporation, the cost of capital has come down, so we have to see whether that has been translated into the interest costs paid by Canadian exporters.

I will not even talk about BDC because I always have issues with BDC. Regarding CCC, we have to see if they have changed their objective or their strategy, so they can help more small Canadian companies enter the export market.

The energy exports have already started going down, not just due to this pandemic, but also due to consumption being affected by, for example, electric vehicles. National gas consumption is affected by the bigger plants being replaced by Megapack batteries. In fact, in Canada the first Megapack batteries are being implemented in Alberta.

Things have changed very dramatically in the last nine or 10 months and we are entering into a new normal. I would like to know what specific measures you are taking to help Canadian small businesses export in this new normal.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

Thanks so much to my honourable colleague for that excellent question.

As you pointed out, Canada has committed to open trade since well before COVID-19. We're committed to trade agreements because they work. We're committed to multilateral, rules-based trade because that works. Rules-based trade establishes stability and predictability in trading relationships. It ensures balance. It ensures fairness. It creates new opportunities for business and it certainly supports well-paying jobs for Canadians. We have preferential access to a billion and a half customers through many economies.

You're absolutely right. Having the trade agreements without the other side, which is to help our Canadian businesses take advantage of those opportunities in the global marketplace, would be a missed opportunity. That is why I proudly serve as Canada's minister for both small business and export promotion—because we have to tell people about it—and also Canada's Minister for International Trade.

Throughout the pandemic—I won't go into the range of emergency supports that we have been providing, but what we have done here in the Canada trade tool box, in the BDC, the EDC, the Canadian Commercial Corporation, Invest In Canada, as well as the trade commissioner service is created an internal working group which is called the business export and trade recovery team.

This incredible, dynamic team is working together during this time of COVID-19 to be sure we are doing everything we possibly can to ensure our businesses have the supports that are needed to help them grow and to grow their businesses into that international marketplace. Complemented by the emergency measures we have in place, this will put them on that right kind of footing, so that they are best primed for the economic recovery when it is time to do so.

We will continue to work very hard to support our small businesses, indeed all of our businesses that are exporting into those international markets, throughout this time.

3:55 p.m.

Liberal

Chandra Arya Liberal Nepean, ON

Thank you, Minister.

I'm—

3:55 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Judy Sgro

Thank you very much, Mr. Arya. I'm sorry, but the time is up.

We will move to Mr. Savard-Tremblay.

3:55 p.m.

Bloc

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay Bloc Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister Ng, for your presentation. I first want to ask a quick question about an aspect of the current negotiations that hasn't been addressed. I'm talking about the negotiations with the Mercosur countries.

Trade is beneficial. Exports will play a significant role in our economic recovery, which we hope will happen as soon as possible. In the case of Mercosur, about a month ago, environmental groups called for a moratorium, given that this is a record-breaking year for forest fires in that part of the world. This could pose a certain threat to our farmers, who, quite frankly, have faced major challenges in recent years. I'm thinking in particular of the poultry sector, which is subject to supply management.

Last Friday, Kendal Hembroff, the director general of trade negotiations at the Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development, confirmed that discussions are still ongoing with that part of the world.

Can you confirm this and tell us whether your department has the political will to move forward in this area?

3:55 p.m.

Liberal

Mary Ng Liberal Markham—Thornhill, ON

Thank you so much for that important question.

Let me begin by saying that our trade decisions will always be based on what is in the interest of Canadians. We do recognize the health of forests in the region and how crucial that is to the well-being of both people and our planet.

Our government is firmly committed to the principle that both free and progressive trade and protecting the environment, as well as indigenous rights, should be mutually supportive.

We, as a government, are committed to pursuing core environmental provisions focused on maintaining high levels of environmental protection and governance. I can assure my colleague that we will continue to look for all trade opportunities, but we will always do so in the best interest of Canadians. I can assure my colleague that we're committed to those values when assessing the possibility of any future trade agreement.

On your question with respect to farmers, there is no question that our farmers, in particular the farmers in Quebec, are so incredibly important to the Canadian economy. I want to assure you that the Prime Minister has been clear that we will be making no supply management concessions in any future trade agreements.

Thank you.