National Defence Committee on June 2nd, 2009

[Prof. Greg Poelzer]

Well, in terms of the investment, here I would suggest not thinking solely about search and rescue and this catastrophic event that might occur. It's great to have the capability for that and that's justifiable in and of itself, but there are other things that having that kind of presence does in terms of the economic spinoffs and the northern development piece, with the support around economic development, social development, communications, telecommunications, and environmental and resource management.

Look at Royal Military College, which is one of the world's leaders, frankly, in environmental management, site reclamation, and so on. DND is at the forefront of that.

So if you look at those spinoffs and that kind of investment over a broader set of activities, it's well worth the investment. I wouldn't limit it to search and rescue.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

I agree with that entirely. I'm saying, let's broaden that focus.

[Prof. Michael Byers]

Could I jump in here for a minute?

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Go ahead, please.

[Prof. Michael Byers]

I agree with you that historically there may not have been a need for dedicated search and rescue assets, but the Arctic is changing very quickly. My colleague David Barber at the University of Manitoba, Canada's leading sea ice scientist, is now predicting a total melt-out of all the Arctic sea ice as early as 2013. We're already seeing 150 cruise ships in Baffin Bay each summer. The amount of activity is increasing at a huge rate.

Yes, David Barber might be wrong, and maybe the ice won't disappear so quickly, but search and rescue, like all issues of national defence, requires planning for the worst-case scenario rather than the best-case scenario. The worst-case scenario, I'd like to suggest, is pretty serious indeed.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

I agree, but it does come back to the matter of having the assets to do that. As it changes, yes, we need to change with it. There's no question about that.

Professor Poelzer, my last one is to you. You have stated—and I don't disagree at all—that in a lot of areas we are probably the least prepared of the eight circumpolar nations. Why do you think that is? How did we get there?

[Prof. Greg Poelzer]

Again, it's a question of how we talk the talk but don't walk the walk. The vast majority of the Canadian population lives in the south. Even if you include the provincial north along with the territorial north, that constitutes about 5% of the Canadian population.

That situation, I argue, is getting worse if you care about the north in terms of where it should sit on the national agenda and the policy agenda. It comes back to two reasons, one being that southernness of Canada and the intergenerational urban Canadians in large urban centres. The disconnect with northern, rural, and aboriginal issues is growing, not decreasing. As well, new Canadians, who are vital for the success of Canada, also tend to settle in southern urban cities.

So in a variety of things, we do need a very proactive engagement of southern Canada with northern and rural Canada. If we don't get on that ball, then the argument about the kind of investment around search and rescue and educational infrastructure is going to be, I suggest, an even steeper hill to climb.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

I agree.

Would you agree that this is a situation that we have been developing over a very long period of time in Canada? You mentioned 1990.

[Prof. Greg Poelzer]

Absolutely. We could say since the post-war period, frankly.

[The Chair, Conservative, Maxime Bernier]

Thank you very much.

I want to thank our two witnesses for being with us by teleconference. I know it is not always easy to do it like that, but it was and it is very profitable for the committee, so thank you very much.

[Prof. Greg Poelzer]

Thank you for the kind invitation.

[Prof. Michael Byers]

Thank you as well.

[The Chair, Conservative, Maxime Bernier]

Thank you.

This concludes the 23^rd meeting of the Standing Committee on National Defence. Thank you very much and have a nice day.

To our witnesses in Europe, I wish you a pleasant day as well. Goodbye.