National Defence Committee on Dec. 8th, 2009

[The Chair, Conservative, Maxime Bernier]

Thank you.

Monsieur Roy.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

General, your message is not clear, and I want to tell you why.

[Gen Walter Natynczyk]

You are saying that my message is not clear.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Your message is not clear and I am going to tell why. In your speech, you have always said and confirmed that it was the end of the mission in Kandahar and the withdrawal of Canadian Forces from Kandahar. On the other hand, Lieutenant-General Lessard is telling us that it is the end of the mission in Afghanistan and that all troops will be repatriated.

On page 15, it states and I quote, “The Canadian Forces will continue to contribute to the whole-of-government mission that relies on a stable security environment. We will continue to support capacity building within the Afghan National Security Forces.” So we are not talking about pulling all of the Canadian Forces out of Afghanistan in July 2011. It is the end of the military mission. There is a nuance between the two.

Have I understood correctly? In your speech, you keep talking about the end of the mission in Kandahar. I understand that the military mission is concentrated in Kandahar, but not all of the troops in Afghanistan will be pulled out in July 2011.

[Gen Walter Natynczyk]

There are two parts to the motion, or two directions for the Canadian Forces. First, the Canadian Forces will leave Kandahar in 2011 and, second, the military mission in Afghanistan will end.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Correct. However, this means that, after July 2011, Canadian soldiers will remain in Afghanistan and will continue to work in education, reconstruction or to ensure the protection of Canadians in mission there, but also in the Kandahar area.

[Gen Walter Natynczyk]

That is not the interpretation that the government provided to me. The government clearly told me that the end of the military mission truly meant the end of missions for men and women in uniform. The Canadian Forces participate in military missions. So there are two parts. All the Canadian Forces will leave Kandahar in 2011.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

They will leave Kandahar, but not Afghanistan.

[Gen Walter Natynczyk]

The military mission in Afghanistan will end in 2011. Aside perhaps from those working in the embassies, we will be leaving.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

That is not what you said in your speech. You said that the Canadian Forces will continue, after July 2011, to contribute to the whole-of-government mission that relies on a stable security environment. You said in your speech that the Canadian Forces will continue to make a contribution in Afghanistan. This means that soldiers will remain in Afghanistan.

[Gen Walter Natynczyk]

Sir, the mandate is clear to us.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

It is not clear.

[LGen J.G.M. Lessard]

To me, it is very clear. The operations in Kandahar province will come to an end in July 2011. All Canadian Forces will have left Afghanistan by the end of the year. When we talk of a military mission, we mean all of its components. That includes the battle group that conducts combat and stability operations. That includes the training of Afghan forces. That also includes troops who are operating with Canadian civilians. We are talking about all the elements of the Canadian Forces.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Lieutenant-General Lessard, I understand, but that is not what the general is telling us. The general is saying that the Canadian Forces will continue to contribute on the ground after July 2011. That is what is written on page 15.

[Gen Walter Natynczyk]

Could there be a translation problem?

[LGen J.G.M. Lessard]

I can tell you that the directives my boss gave me in August are very clear. Much has been said about them. It is very clear to me that we will cease operations in Kandahar in July 2011, and all Canadian Forces will have left Afghanistan by year end.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Are you sure they will have all left and there will not be a single soldier left in Afghanistan? That is what I want to know.

[Gen Walter Natynczyk]

Could the attaché still be there? The problem isn't the military mission. When we ensure the protection component of a development project, our duty is to defend the people involved and ensure security, whether in a development mission or while training Afghan forces and Afghan police. It remains a potential security and combat mission. The problem is with the actual definition of the term “military”. The government has given me that definition and that is the mission we are accomplishing as members of the armed forces.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Therefore, soldiers will remain on the ground to carry out security missions.

[LGen J.G.M. Lessard]

I will repeat this so that it is very, very clear. My mandate and what I am responsible for—in partnership with General McQuillan, who will be of great assistance with regard to the equipment—is to repatriate the men and women of the Canadian Forces, as well as all the equipment, by the end of 2011. That is very clear: they will be back in Canada, or at least will have left Afghanistan.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Very well, thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Maxime Bernier]

Thank you very much.

I will give the floor to Mr. Payne for five minutes.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I'd like to thank the generals for coming here today.

It's very important and quite clear that our Canadian Forces will be out of Afghanistan, as stated by Parliament and General Natynczyk.

I have a number of questions, and hopefully I'll get through them all.

I'm wondering if you can tell us what the Canadian Forces and the Department of Foreign Affairs have done for Afghanistan as far as building infrastructure and helping the country move forward.

[Gen Walter Natynczyk]

Given that General Lessard was living there on the ground for nine months and has been commanding CEFCOM these past few months, I think he can give us a pretty good overview.

[LGen J.G.M. Lessard]

I won't go through the whole list. This is more the expertise of DFAIT or CIDA.

Whether it's small hospitals or schools, a significant number of buildings have been built. But it's not the buildings per se; it's the capability. I think we're missing the point here when we look at mortar and bricks. Southern Afghanistan is tribal and extremely rural, so it's not just buildings that you need—perhaps in Kandahar City. You need things that help farmers, like irrigation and wells. It's those simple things that facilitate a heavy agricultural economy.