National Defence Committee on March 25th, 2015

[The Chair, Conservative, Peter Kent]

Colleagues, pursuant to Standing Orders 110 and 111, we are examining the order in council appointment of Greta Bossenmaier to the position of chief of the Communications Security Establishment, referred to the committee on Friday, February 20, 2015.

Thank you very much for joining us here today. Let us have your opening statement please, Ms. Bossenmaier.

[Greta Bossenmaier, Chief, Communications Security Establishment]

Good afternoon, Mr. Chair and members of the committee. Thank you for inviting me here today to speak about my qualifications and my recent appointment as chief of the Communications Security Establishment.

Let me begin by taking a few minutes to introduce myself, and then I will be pleased to answer your questions.

I understand that you have been provided with a copy of my resume.

I'm originally from Winnipeg and come from a family of public servants who have served at the federal, provincial, and municipal levels of government. I grew up understanding the importance and the values of public service, including serving with integrity and respect. Joining the public service was a natural career choice for me, and I have now had the honour of being a federal public servant for more than 30 years, with seven of those years at the associate or deputy minister level.

My first job in the federal public service was as a summer student with the Department of National Defence while studying at the University of Manitoba. For two summers, I worked as a defence scientist in Air Command. Working in direct support of the Canadian Armed Forces brought home for me the military's critical role and also the vital work that is done by public servants to enable their missions and to serve Canadians.

After graduating from Stanford University in California with a master's degree from the School of Engineering, I moved to Ottawa to join the Operational Research and Analysis Establishment of the Department of National Defence.

Over the past 30 years, I have had the privilege of serving in seven government departments, including Foreign Affairs, the Privy Council Office, the Canada Border Services Agency, the Canadian International Development Agency and National Defence.

Throughout my career, my key areas of focus have been in international affairs, defence, security, technology, innovation and whole-of-government initiatives. Along with these areas of focus, I have had the opportunity to lead and manage diverse organizations of talented public servants and have worked closely with the Canadian armed forces and with international partners.

I was both humbled and honoured to be asked to serve as the chief of the Communications Security Establishment. lt is a unique institution within the Government of Canada and one of Canada's key security and intelligence organizations. For almost 70 years, the CSE has played a vital role in helping to protect the security of Canada and all Canadians. ln today's challenging and dynamic security environment, the CSE's foreign intelligence collection and Government of Canada cyber-defence roles are more critical and relevant than ever.

Before closing, Mr. Chair, I would like to share with you some of my initial impressions of the Communications Security Establishment, CSE. Since arriving in the organization six weeks ago, I've been impressed by the dedication, commitment and professionalism of its employees. The calibre of the people in CSE is one of its greatest assets.

I believe that a key part of my job is to provide the leadership necessary to ensure that CSE remains a high-performing organization dedicated to helping to protect the security and national interests of Canada and Canadians.

As well, I have already observed first-hand the commitment throughout the organization to respect CSE's legal framework, including the privacy of Canadians. This culture of compliance has been affirmed by the independent commissioner of CSE. I can assure the committee that I take very seriously my responsibilities to ensure that the organization complies with the law and protects the privacy of Canadians.

It has also been important for me to realize that, by operational necessity and in keeping with the law, much of the important work of CSE will never be widely known. Against this backdrop, I welcome the opportunity to underscore the work of the women and men of CSE and their important contributions to Canada's security.

Mr. Chair, I look forward to continuing to serve Canadians in my new role as chief of CSE and to lead the organization to continue to deliver on its mandate to help protect Canada and Canadians.

Thank you for your attention. It would be my pleasure to answer the questions of the distinguished members of the committee.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Peter Kent]

Thank you, Ms. Bossenmaier.

Mr. Bezan, please, for five minutes.

[James Bezan, Conservative, Selkirk—Interlake, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Congratulations, Ms. Bossenmaier, on your appointment. It's always great to see people from friendly Manitoba moving up the ranks in the civil service. I don't know if I've ever mentioned, Mr. Chair, how great the people are from Manitoba.

[Voices]

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[James Bezan, Conservative, Selkirk—Interlake, MB]

You have a very interesting background and have had very interesting career opportunities. Can you talk about how your mix of work at Foreign Affairs, International Development, and National Defence coalesced into what you're doing today at CSE?

[Greta Bossenmaier]

Thank you very much.

You know, when you come into a new job, you do spend a bit of time reflecting on what you can bring to the position. I was very humbled and honoured to be asked to assume this position as chief of CSE. With regard to my reflections, I guess I would highlight a couple of my experiences and the background that I hope will help me in this position and will help me advance the objectives of the organization.

First of all, I come from an analytical background. I have a master's degree in operational research and feel very comfortable when dealing with analytical issues. I think that will serve me well given the type of work we do at CSE and given a lot of the types of employees that we have at CSE.

Second, I reflected on the fact that I have been a chief information officer or have had responsibilities in terms of being a chief information officer in three different federal government departments: the Department of Fisheries and Oceans, the Department of Foreign Affairs, and also the Canada Border Services Agency, all organizations for which information and technology are very important.

When I think about the work of the Canada Border Services Agency or Foreign Affairs, the security of information was very important from a Foreign Affairs perspective in regard to how we ensured that the information for all of our embassies abroad and the people who were serving abroad was available and was protected. Being a chief information officer I think will serve me well in understanding the important cyber-defence role that we play at CSE.

As you pointed out, I've also worked in a number of departments that have an international background or flavour, such as Foreign Affairs, of course, and also the Canadian International Development Agency, which has an international focus. What was interesting there is that in this committee, your committee, I was able to see the work of the Canadian Armed Forces along with that of development experts coming together to deal with some very important humanitarian issues.

My work on the Afghanistan task force when I was at the Privy Council office was a very important role, and one I took very seriously. It was also an opportunity to see what it was like being on the client end of the work of the Communications Security Establishment and dealing with international issues.

Finally, reflecting on this, I have had a number of different types of management and leadership responsibilities, some in large organizations like the Border Services Agency and Foreign Affairs, and smaller ones in terms of the Afghanistan task force, which is really a whole-of-government task force. I think the diversity of those leadership and management experiences will serve me well in this position at the Communications Security Establishment.

[James Bezan, Conservative, Selkirk—Interlake, MB]

As you mentioned, technology is the critical factor at CSE and also having the right personnel to stay on the leading edge of things as they are changing. Of course, we're dealing right now with the Canadian Armed Forces being in the theatre against ISIL, who are being a little overt in some of their communications. Can you talk about how you're dealing with this challenge that we have right now to ensure that the members of the Canadian Armed Forces that are in the theatre are safe?

[Greta Bossenmaier]

An important role for CSE throughout the years, both when it was part of the Department of National Defence and now is a stand-alone agency under the Minister of National Defence, has been to work closely with the Canadian Armed Forces.

I can tell you from my experience in Afghanistan on that task force that I saw the important working relationships from a whole-of-government perspective, but I also saw the importance of good intelligence and good cooperation between the Canadian Armed Forces and the work of CSE. I hope and I'm sure that's something that will continue under my leadership as well.

[James Bezan, Conservative, Selkirk—Interlake, MB]

You mentioned the importance of the role CSE plays in cyber-defence. We, of course, are just wrapping up a study on defence of North America. Cybersecurity has become a major part of that study. Can you talk about the role CSE plays in cyber-defence for Canada?

[Greta Bossenmaier]

CSE actually plays a really important role in the cyber-defence world. As this committee appreciates, I'm sure, and as we hear almost every day in some kind of news story, there are increasing threats and concerns in terms of cyber-defence, whether it's from our own personal situations to private sector companies and of course, to government. It's a very dynamic environment now in terms of the variety of different threats to systems. I think that's going to be a really important part of my role going forward.

CSE is a lead security agency from an IT perspective for the Government of Canada. An important role is that cyber-defence role of trying to ensure, along with our partners, such as Shared Services Canada, the Treasury Board Secretariat, and Public Safety, that government systems remain safe and secure, and that the information they hold remains safe and secure.

We have a really skilled team at the CSE that works diligently to protect Government of Canada systems, and I'm sure that will be a very important part of my role in the coming years.

[The Chair, Conservative, Peter Kent]

Thank you, Mr. Bezan.

Ms. Michaud, you have the floor. You have five minutes.

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Ms. Bossenmaier, thank you for your testimony, and congratulations on your appointment.

I was happy to hear you mention the importance of respecting CSE's legal framework, and I would like you to give me a few clarifications as the new chief of the establishment.

Recently there have been several allegations that the CSE was increasingly spying on Canadian citizens by collecting metadata in airports using wireless networks or by analyzing downloads and uploads from everywhere in the world in the context of a project entitled “Levitation”. We also learned that beyond defensive and offensive capacities, CSE is developing the possibility of pirating certain devices throughout the world or of collecting data from these devices. It is alleged that the establishment did this in Mexico, a country that is our ally and commercial partner.

Can you confirm that or provide us with further details on this more offensive vocation the CSE seems to be taking on? Is that one of the directions the establishment intends to take?

[Greta Bossenmaier]

Thank you for the question.

I hope you can appreciate that I cannot comment on the unauthorized disclosure of classified information. To do so would put me at risk in terms of violating the Security of Information Act. I hope you can appreciate that.

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

In that case, could you explain a bit better what threat could lead the CSE to play a more offensive role? Without directly describing the facts, I think that you could explain to us what could push the CSE to take more offensive measures, either against enemy countries, or conceivably against allied countries, as was reported.

[Greta Bossenmaier]

Thank you again for your question.

It would be inappropriate for me to be speaking about the operations, capabilities, or the methods that—

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

That is not what I am asking you.

[Greta Bossenmaier]

—CSE uses.

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

That is not the question I put to you.

I asked what threat in today's world could justify that the CSE turn to offensive rather than defensive techniques? I'm not asking you to comment on operations as such, but to comment on the environment that could force the CSE to make certain decisions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Peter Kent]

Certainly the committee understands your situation, Ms. Bossenmaier, and the requirements of maintaining secure the operational intent of the CSE. If there is any element of that question that you do feel comfortable in answering, the committee would be glad to hear it. If you would rather not, the committee will fully understand, and I'll support that decision.

[Greta Bossenmaier]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

What I can say is this. CSE's foreign intelligence collection operations and activities are founded on the basis of the National Defence Act. They are in the law under the National Defence Act. We collect foreign intelligence and conduct our foreign intelligence activities according to the government's intelligence priorities.

As you know, all of CSE's activities are reviewed by an independent commissioner who oversees all of CSE's activities. That commissioner has full access to all of our systems, our people, our information, and our repositories. He has the power of subpoena. He has never found CSE to be unlawful in any of its activities.

That is what I can tell you, Mr. Chair. Commenting on any specific or potential capabilities or operations of the Communications Security Establishment would be inappropriate of me.

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Thank you.

I think that your answer demonstrates once again how essential it is that we have a parliamentary oversight committee that is empowered to analyze what is going on in the security field. Currently, accountability to parliamentarians is strictly impossible. Nor can they obtain replies to legitimate questions. I thank you for having helped me to clarify that situation somewhat.

In another connection, can you tell us how the construction of the new headquarters is going? Will there be delays and additional costs? There have already been some quite major cost overruns.

[Greta Bossenmaier]

Thank you for those questions.

Mr. Chair, if I could just go back to the previous question, I did remark that as part of the legislation CSE has an independent commissioner who oversees all of our activities, and again, he has never found CSE to have acted unlawfully.

In terms of our new building, I'm pleased to say that CSE has moved into the new building. That move happened in the fall. It was a little bit before my time, so I don't have the exact date. I'm going to say that it was perhaps this past October or September.

CSE is in the new building and we are now working collectively in this new building. Our finding is that it very much suits our needs, compared to a number of issues that were faced by the organization in the previous building. Again, I never had the opportunity to work in the previous building, but I understand that it had a number of operational limitations. We have moved in, as of this past fall, and are becoming accustomed to our new neighbourhood and our new working environment.

[The Chair, Conservative, Peter Kent]

The clarity of your response to the previous question is on the record, so thank you very much.

Mr. Chisu, please. You have five minutes.

[Corneliu Chisu, Conservative, Pickering—Scarborough East, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you very much, Ms. Bossenmaier, for your presentation and your presence here. Congratulations on your appointment.