I think that's very insightful. There is a fine line between doing something 30 years ago that was rape and doing something 30 years ago that was a really bad joke. We have to recognize that.
We also have to recognize the difference between people who are trying to do the right thing and are just slipping up and others who are resisting women in the workplace. We can tell the difference. In terms of the odd joke, it hurts and it demeans women, but sometimes it is meant to be buddy-buddy. At other times, it is meant to highlight that you're not wanted there. We have to discern the difference between the intentions.
Right now, I sit on a committee with the commissionaires. I'm the only woman. Occasionally they will refer to me as their “diversity”. They will say, “Well, let's ask our diversity.” It's wrong, but they mean well, and they're trying really hard to grow and to think outside the box.
We have to be able to tell the difference. If people come forward with their experience from way back when and recognize that it was wrong, we shouldn't be punishing them, unless it was a criminal offence. We should be rewarding them for recognizing it and growing.