Can I give you two quick points?
One is that small arms are already showing up in Europe from the conflict in Ukraine, especially in the weapons markets in Belgium, and are being used by people who we consider as terrorists. So there would be the proliferation of small arms, if we had that sort of collapse.
The other is the proliferation of dual-use nuclear weapons technology. We already know that liquid fuel rocket engines from a company in Ukraine are very likely finding their way to North Korea, because there's only one company in the world that makes the engines that are projecting some of the missiles of the North Korean regime.
If we want to avoid that, we want to avoid the collapse of Ukraine, but we also need to make sure that the Ukrainian government plays by the rules. It says it knows nothing about this, but I think this is something on which Canada needs to press Ukraine much harder. We can't have people indirectly having dual-use technology, having it show up in North Korea.