National Defence Committee on Oct. 10th, 2024

[Don Stewart, Conservative, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

Would this be the same in theatre, as in, “Sorry, there's a shortage; there's no ammo”?

[LGen Stephen Kelsey]

No, Mr. Chair, we would privilege those folks who are—

[Don Stewart, Conservative, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

Now that we're in kind of a globally hot situation, would we not want our soldiers to be trained up and certified on weapons in terms of readiness? Does this not speak to a gap in that?

[LGen Stephen Kelsey]

We agree that we would need a sufficient amount of munition, training areas and equipment to elevate a higher level of readiness across the board. The issue for us right now is also people. It's the munition availability and the stocks that we hold, but also a function of the time needed in the location.

I think the example was one of our fine reserve units. Not every unit is at the same level of readiness in our current construct, and therefore, depending on which one we use to elevate its training, may or may not have the ammunition we need.

[Don Stewart, Conservative, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

Okay.

Sticking with supply chains, recently there were some reports about our Arctic abilities, including the sleeping bag systems for our soldiers. Is there a plan in place to correct that so that we can operate in our Arctic environments?

[Stefanie Beck, Deputy Minister, Department of National Defence]

There is indeed.

I think as everyone knows, in terms of those sleeping bags, that system in fact was procured very much as the army had requested. Notwithstanding that, there was always a plan for a second round to ensure that those for temperatures even colder than those required for that particular set were available. That contract is being let.

[Don Stewart, Conservative, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

I have a quick question about morale. Morale is such an important thing in the army. One thing that can improve morale is that every soldier has a complete kit. Does every soldier in the army have a sleeping bag, Arctic or not?

[Stefanie Beck]

Every soldier who needs to have a sleeping bag would have the appropriate kit.

[Don Stewart, Conservative, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

When I was with the reserves, we were asked to bring our sleeping bags back in because there weren't enough for soldiers who were being deployed.

[Stefanie Beck]

It would be the regular armed forces, right?

[LGen Stephen Kelsey]

I think, Chair, the question is fundamental to what we want to do with our reserves. We want to do more. We want to equip them better, but we also need to make choices. We want to spend the dollars we have available wisely. It means, unfortunately, that we manage equipment for the right time and the right place. Some units don't have all the equipment they wish they had.

[Don Stewart, Conservative, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

That's all I've got. Thank you.

[James Bezan, Conservative, Selkirk—Interlake—Eastman, MB]

Can I take that last one?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

No, you can't.

Madam Lalonde, you have six minutes.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Thank you very much.

I'll come to you in a minute. I just want to bring forward and put on notice a motion.

The reason I am doing this is that there were some very reckless comments made by the leader of the official opposition on Monday night:

“I will vote against anti-Israel resolutions at the United Nations,” he said. “I will back Israel's right to defend itself, which includes retaliating against those that attack Israel. Israel must be able to prevent Iran from using nuclear weapons, if necessary, that means proactively striking Iranian nuclear sites and oil installations to defund the terrorist regime.”

For that reason, Mr. Chair, I would like to put on notice a motion. It reads as follows:

Given the reckless and dangerous comments of the Leader of the Opposition, Pierre Poilievre, calling for potential strikes against Iranian nuclear facilities, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) the committee undertake a study of the law of armed conflict and Canada’s obligations under international law.

Thank you very much.

I'm sorry about that. Thank you very much.

I want to say thanks to all of you for coming in front of our committee.

Ms. Hadwen, the minister did share and make reference to the possibility that you could continue expanding on some of the most recent investments made and the importance of your department, but also in the context of the international risk regarding cybersecurity, cyber-attacks, AI and everything. I know that there has been some great news, and I would really like you to expand on that for us this morning.

[Wendy Hadwen, Deputy Chief, Strategic Policy, Planning and Partnerships, Communications Security Establishment]

Thank you for the question, Ms. Lalonde.

Since 2020, CSE's Cyber Centre has been publicly warning that the state-sponsored cyber programs of the PRC, Russia, Iran and North Korea represent a significant threat. At least 20 incidents of malicious cyber-activity on GC networks are talked about in our most recent annual report.

As the minister mentioned, we received, in the “Our North Strong and Free” defence policy update, approximately $3 billion for the CSE to work together with the Canadian Armed Forces' new cyber command, in order to do everything in our capabilities using the full mandates we have, respectively, to counter these threats.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Thank you very much for that. It is extremely good news.

I also understand, in talking with industry and individuals in that sphere, that Canada is leading. We're very proud of this. Thank you.

On another subject very dear to me—it was also briefly touched on by the minister—I had the pleasure, over the summer, of visiting numerous military bases and speaking with senior-ranking officers. I also spoke with lower-ranking officers. Their passion and energy, and their desire to serve our country, were extraordinary. I also know about recruitment and retention. That's also something they shared with me.

Could you further expand, for this committee, on some of the initiatives you would like to see go forward, in order to help the recruitment and retention piece?

[Stefanie Beck]

I'll start.

Thank you very much for the question. I'll answer first, but I'll let my colleagues give me a hand afterwards.

It's a very complex question, and one we have broken down into many different parts within the department, because restraints on recruitment revolve around many different things that have been touched upon already in this committee.

Questions around how slow we are to move people through the onboarding system, the security clearances required, the medical processes required, the training facilities we have, the barracks that are available or not, and the equipment.... Each of these things is a separate challenge we are dealing with individually so that, as a whole, we will be able to—as the chief said recently—not only hire 6,400 a year but also hopefully more than that.

In terms of retention, that goes hand in hand with offering adequate housing and making sure our CAF members are properly paid—which is the case, as they received salary increases last year. Of course, it's also about ensuring they have careers that are interesting and fulfilling. I think we can see that part easily. These are jobs people want to do.

We have no problem with the number of folks approaching us. We have a greater problem moving them through quickly enough that we manage to retain them.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

You have about 30 seconds.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Please continue.

[LGen Stephen Kelsey]

It's heartening to learn about the motivation of young Canadians, and it's easy to be inspired. We must redouble our efforts and our responsibility to them.

This committee has recognized the connections between professional conduct and culture, people and recruitment, and how these affect readiness. Therefore it's no surprise to the committee that recruitment and changes to process, procedure and mindset are the number one priority for both our deputy and the chief of defence.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Thank you.

Ms. Normandin, the floor is yours for six minutes.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I thank the witnesses for being here.

I want to come back to the question I asked the minister in connection with the impact of budget cuts on troop training capabilities. The minister didn't say he hadn't heard that there had been negative repercussions. He was affirmative: He said there had been no impact. If he can be that assertive, I take it that studies have been done, or perhaps an impact analysis.

I'd like to know if any such studies have been carried out. If so, could those stating that there has been no impact on troop training be forwarded to the committee?

[Stefanie Beck]

I couldn't put my finger on any particular study. Having said that, it's important to make sure that we're able to train people as we go along so that they're ready when they need to be. Across the country, troops are being trained to be ready. This is called operational readiness. We need to ensure that troops are able to participate not only in the exercises we do in Canada, but also in the exercises we do abroad with our international partners. This is also the case for the deployment of troops to Latvia. As you can see, if we've been able to deploy these people and they've been able to participate in the exercises, it's because we've been able to work out the training issues as we go along.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

As demand is growing, I would like to know if we have any documentation indicating that training is proportional to this growing demand and that this does not pose any problems in terms of resources.