National Defence Committee on Nov. 24th, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

The meeting is called to order.

We welcome Vice-Admiral Auchterlonie, Major-General Iain Huddleston, Brigadier-General Pascal Godbout and one of our favourite frequent flyers, Jonathan Quinn, to the defence committee.

Gentlemen, you're all quite experienced, so I don't need to—

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Excuse me, Mr. Chair, but just before the witnesses begin their presentations, I would like to know whether the necessary sound tests were done first.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

I missed all that, but it's good.

With that, I don't know who is going to proceed with the opening five-minute statement, but I see Vice-Admiral Auchterlonie leaning into the microphone, so I assume it's him.

[Vice-Admiral J.R. Auchterlonie, Commander of the Canadian Joint Operations Command, Canadian Armed Forces, Department of National Defence]

Thank very much.

Good morning, Mr. Chair. It's very good to see you and the committee.

Thank you again for the opportunity to continue this important discussion and conversation on security and defence in the north.

For the information of committee members, allow me to introduce myself: I am Vice-Admiral Bob Auchterlonie, Commander of the Canadian Joint Operations Command. I am responsible for all operations in Canada, including search and rescue and northern operations. I am also responsible for operations in North America, with my NORAD colleagues, and for operations deployed throughout the world.

In that role, I'm supported and enabled by a range of folks and experts, three of whom are with me here this morning.

First, from 1 Canadian Air Division, we have Major-General Iain Huddleston. As the CAF's joint force air component commander, he is responsible for the apportionment and force employment of all Royal Canadian Air Force assets domestically and abroad, including those that are employed in SAR activities in the north. In addition, he is also the SAR commander for central Canada and the north.

From the Department of National Defence policy group, I'm joined again by our frequent flyer, Jonathan Quinn. As director general for continental defence, he has been the organizational leader in advancing NORAD modernization initiatives, many of which are directly linked to CAF's ability to operate in the north.

Finally, I am also joined by the commander of Joint Task Force (North), Brigadier-General Pascal Godbout. In his role as the regional commander, he has responsibilities for search and rescue responses that may be demanded of the armed forces in the north.

Mr. Chair, in order to provide you a detailed understanding of his roles and responsibility, I'm going to give the floor to General Godbout for a few minutes.

Thank you.

[Brigadier-General Pascal Godbout, Commander, Joint Task Force (North), Canadian Armed Forces, Department of National Defence]

Thank you, sir.

Good morning, Mr. Chair and members of Parliament. Thank you for this opportunity to speak about Arctic security.

I am Brigadier-General Pascal Godbout. I'm the Commander of Joint Task Force (North).

I am speaking to you from Sǫǫ̀mba K’è on Chief Drygeese Territories on Treaty No. 8, the traditional home of the Yellowknives Dene and the North Slave Métis. This place is also known as Yellowknife, Northwest Territories.

The role of Joint Task Force (North) is to lead Canadian Armed Forces' northern operations across all three territories. My responsibilities do not include the coordination of NORAD operations or aeronautical search and rescue, which falls under other organizations.

The Canadian north is a truly unique environment. While it represents 40% of our land mass, it is very sparsely populated, with only 0.4% of the Canadian population living here. The northern population is 50% indigenous compared to a national average indigenous population of 5%, and there is very limited infrastructure in terms of transportation, energy and communication.

The Canadian Arctic is also very different from other Arctic regions across the globe. Alaska has a population density 10 times larger than the Territories, with 750,000 people. In western Europe, there are an estimated one million people living north of 60, with a much more extensive infrastructure and economy. Finally, Russia has over two million people living in their Arctic.

The permanent presence of the Canadian Armed Forces in the north is made up of approximately 340 members of the defence team, including the members assigned to Canadian Forces Station Alert, and over 1,700 Canadian Rangers. All in all, that means that approximately 1.5 per cent of the population of the territories is affiliated with the Canadian Armed Forces, as compared to approximately 0.25 per cent in the rest of Canada, excluding personnel affiliated with the cadets program, who cannot be deployed in operations.

The Canadian Armed Forces have personnel and infrastructure in Yellowknife, Whitehorse, Iqaluit, Inuvik, Canadian Armed Forces Alert, Resolute Bay, Fort Eureka and Nanisivik. We have Canadian Rangers in 65 of the 72 communities in the north. In addition, 47 North Warning System sites are located in Canada.

Joint Operations Command activities in the north can be divided into four roles: showing a visible, consistent presence; surveillance and control; support for northern populations and communities; and cooperation with all of government.

Partnerships are critical to our success. As such, we routinely collaborate with other federal departments, territorial and indigenous governments, academia and international allies and partners. We do so through regular forums, such as the Arctic Security Forces Roundtable; the Arctic security working group, which is taking place right now here in Yellowknife; various engagements throughout the year; and of course both deliberate and contingency operations.

We plan and execute operations throughout the year. This includes Operation Nanook, our series of comprehensive activities designed to exercise the defence of Canada and secure our northern regions; Operation Limpid, an operation designed to keep routine watch over Canada's aerospace, maritime and land domains; and Operation Nevus, the annual maintenance of the High Arctic data communications system.

We also execute contingency operations where and when necessary, including Operation Laser, which is the Canadian Armed Forces' response to a global pandemic situation, Operation Lentus, which is the Canadian Armed Forces' response to natural disasters in Canada, and, at the request of the territories, support for ground search and rescue operations, which are coordinated by other organizations.

I'll be happy to answer questions on these roles and activities.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

With that, we'll turn to our six-minute round.

Mr. Kelly, you have six minutes, please.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Thank you.

With the cancellation, or I guess the non-renewal, of the contract with international logistics support for hangarage and refuelling capability in Inuvik, does that affect our capacity to refuel and deploy and have aircraft assets in the air in defence of our security and sovereignty in the northwest Arctic?

[VAdm J.R. Auchterlonie]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I believe you're referring to what's sometimes referred to as the “green hangar”. I will first give you a response, and then I'll turn it over to General Huddleston, who in fact is our Canadian NORAD commander.

Canada remains committed to supporting security and Arctic sovereignty and ensuring that we have the equipment and infrastructure in place to enable Canadians to maintain sovereignty in the north. In terms of strategic investments, I think you've already heard they include $6.1 billion over five years in this budget, and almost $40 billion for NORAD modernization moving forward. Specifically, we're looking at capabilities and infrastructure in the north.

I'm going to turn to General Huddleston, our Canadian region commander for NORAD, to discuss the specifics.

[Major-General Iain Huddleston, Commander, Canadian NORAD Region, Canadian Armed Forces, Department of National Defence]

Thank you, sir.

Thank you, Mr. Chair, for the question.

With respect to the green hangar specifically, it is not essential to our NORAD or search and rescue operations in the north. However, it's certainly useful, as any infrastructure is in the north for things like storage or potentially larger footprints of deployed personnel and aircraft, but it is not essential to our current NORAD mandate or search and rescue mandate.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

You've said it's not essential. We understand that an American naval attaché was interested in possibly purchasing this asset. We also had some disturbing testimony about Chinese embassy officials kicking tires—I don't know how else to put it—in Inuvik and Tuktoyaktuk over some of these assets. If these are not essential, why are the Americans and apparently the Chinese government both interested in these assets?

[MGen Iain Huddleston]

That's not my area of expertise. I'm the operational commander. I've certainly heard the things that you've just suggested.

I think potentially Admiral Auchterlonie or Jon Quinn would be better placed to answer that question for you, Mr. Chair.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Actually, I want to go back to the question of whether or not these assets are essential. You said they're useful but not essential. What alternative is there to those facilities? What other options are you currently utilizing?

I'm not talking about the money that's been promised for five, 10 or 20 years down the road, but for today. What replaces those specific assets?

[MGen Iain Huddleston]

I'll get into the details. That hangar used to be useful for us to forward-deploy our Hercules tactical tanker. It was used for no other reason. The forward operating location in Inuvik is fully capable of supporting the F-18s. We no longer use the Hercules tactical tanker to support that mission. Therefore, we do not need the green hangar in order to support NORAD operations.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

F-18s can be supported from Inuvik without that hangar.

[MGen Iain Huddleston]

Affirmative.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Thank you.

What do you make of this testimony? The testimony from Mr. Klapatiuk at committee was:

We've had Chinese from the Chinese embassy in Ottawa come through Inuvik. The RCMP tried to identify them, but we'll leave that one alone.

We were at the end of the round and there wasn't time. What was left unsaid?

[VAdm J.R. Auchterlonie]

This is the ninth hearing on security and defence in the north. To be clear, I'm going to say that all of the folks who have testified before are right. This is an incredibly complex and intertwined problem set. Even those with competing views over the last nine hearings are correct in their assessments, given the complexity. The threats to national security and defence in the Arctic as a whole are not just one department's problem. Instead, it's a whole-of-government thing.

I will pass to Jonathan Quinn, whom you've heard from before, to discuss the specific policy.

[Jonathan Quinn, Director General, Continental Defence Policy, Canadian Armed Forces, Department of National Defence]

Thanks very much, sir.

Thanks for the question, Mr. Chair.

I'm sorry if there's—

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

It's all right. Proceed.

Mr. Kelly wanted to know how much time he has left. He has about a minute, but we'll be a little generous today.

[Jonathan Quinn]

Okay. I'm sorry.

Very quickly then, Mr. Chair, we are monitoring the potential interest in this facility from potential buyers. Should a foreign company purchase the ILS hangar, it would trigger a requirement for notification under the Investment Canada Act.

As of today, no notification has been received, but there are robust measures in place to make sure that the facility does not fall into the wrong hands.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Will there be...? Let's start with on what date we will receive any F-35 aircraft. Can they be hangared and supported with existing facilities in Inuvik?

[VAdm J.R. Auchterlonie]

Iain, I'll pass that to you.

[MGen Iain Huddleston]

For the F-35s, I don't have the initial operational capability date in mind. I was focused on prepping for search and rescue questions.

However, the F-35 is being delivered in conjunction with a huge investment in infrastructure that will properly support the fighters and the defence of Canada fighter infrastructure, which very much includes a renovation and a refresh of all the forward operating locations in the north in order to properly support the F-35—

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Unfortunately, we're going to have to leave Mr. Kelly's question there.

Thank you, Mr. Kelly.

Mr. May, you have six minutes.

[Bryan May, Liberal, Cambridge, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Vice-Admiral, to you and your team, for being here. Please extend our thanks to all those who have appeared.

When you said this was our ninth time, it took me aback. We have been at this for a while. We very much appreciate all of the insight from you and your team.

My question to you, sir, is, what is the current state of Canada's multidomain awareness in the Arctic? What investments are currently planned to improve awareness capabilities, following from the NORAD modernization plan?