Evidence of meeting #60 for National Defence in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was crisis.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Col (Ret'd) Richard Pucci
It depends upon the terms of your release. If you have a medical release, you have access to Veterans Affairs Canada, which provides you with a case manager who helps you facilitate and manoeuvre through the health care system.
If you were released on a normal...I think it's a 5A release, which is just a normal release.... If you have no physical or mental health conditions, you're just put out onto the street, and you look after yourself.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Mrs. Tam-Seto, you talked about some type of relationship between provinces, territories and the federal government. I suspect you mean some type of bilateral agreement whereby a CAF member would transition out and there would be some type of partnership between each.
We talked about your trial projects in Beechwood and Tay River. We used the example when Madam Gallant was talking about examples from southern Ontario.
However, when you think about cities and towns across the country, and you talk about two trial projects—which I salute you for; it sounds like a great idea—what happens when it's somebody in rural Nova Scotia or northern B.C.?
Col (Ret'd) Richard Pucci
There would be access to technology through telemedicine. We could access that. We would have hubs within the provincial jurisdiction, where veterans could use telemedicine to connect with a physician.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
What are your thoughts on...? Were you envisioning a bilateral agreement from province to province and territory to territory?
Assistant Professor, McMaster University, Canadian Institute for Military and Veteran Health Research
There needs to be a mechanism whereby there's agreement across different jurisdictions and different ministries to be able to make that seamless. Right now, it's piecemeal, and the responsibility lies at the doorstep of the veteran.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Are there any provinces right now that give rapid access or front-of-the-line access to CAF members transitioning into veterans in provinces? Who does it well?
Assistant Professor, McMaster University, Canadian Institute for Military and Veteran Health Research
I don't have an answer for that.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
You don't have an answer for that. Okay.
Earlier, in your opening statement, you spoke about challenges, barriers and delays, but then your time for your opening statement ended.
Can you touch a bit more deeply on the challenges, barriers and delays—things that we may not have talked about yet today?
Assistant Professor, McMaster University, Canadian Institute for Military and Veteran Health Research
I think I did touch on that somewhat, and yes, I will be providing a brief in which things are a bit more clearly articulated, because there are so many layers. It just needs to be a much more organized discussion than the one I can share right now.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Colonel Pucci gave us four recommendations. Do you have any recommendations? Is that something you're able to provide us right now, or is that something you'll put in your written statement?
Assistant Professor, McMaster University, Canadian Institute for Military and Veteran Health Research
I'll put it in my written statement, but I think there needs to be this recognition that there is a system breakdown right now. That's the first piece. We need to get the right people at the table to have an initial conversation on what that pathway of transition might look like. Once they're in the door, we'll have different groups of people sitting around in order to ensure quality of care.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
I'm going to ask all three of you whether you have a comment and if you wish to chime in.
I've heard it said that it would be better for CAF members to stay in the CAF continually as veterans, and never transition out into Veterans Affairs, basically combining the two.
Assistant Professor, McMaster University, Canadian Institute for Military and Veteran Health Research
I don't have an opinion on how people should continue to get health services. I just feel that there should not be the gap that exists right now.
Col (Ret'd) Richard Pucci
I don't think there's a capability. It's all about capacity building. In the CAF's health services, when I was deputy commander, we would not have the capacity to support veterans while they were transitioning or when they had transitioned out of the military.
If you look at the U.S. model, it has the Tricare capability, whereby a veteran reports to the same sick parade as does a serving member. We don't have 300 doctors in uniform. We barely have a handful at times, so the biggest challenge is capacity, capacity and capacity.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Madame Lafond, I don't know whether you want to speak to that specifically, but I was also interested in your crisis beds.
Are crisis beds filled only with military members? I wasn't sure if there would ever be an instance in which a crisis bed was assigned to a veteran or somebody who is in the process of transitioning.
Managing Director, Crisis Center and Suicide Prevention of Haut-Richelieu-Rouville
In our case, it's mostly Haut‑Richelieu‑Rouville residents. The military only represents a tiny part of our clientele. We mainly have recruits stay with us, but sometimes we've also had veterans or military personnel who were on “vacation” or “leave”—that's how they put it, unfortunately. They were training recruits on the military base.
The service member was a teacher or trainer who worked with recruits on the base. He was experiencing mental and physical health issues, and required certain services. He came to the centre for some guidance.
Veterans and active military personnel very rarely use our services; we mostly serve recruits.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal John McKay
Thank you, Mr. Fisher.
Before I thank our witnesses, it was suggested to me that I should read this statement, given the subject matter of today's conversation.
Given that the subject matter of today's meeting dealt with issues surrounding suicide and self-harm, I want to take a moment to remind all those watching that resources are available if you or someone you know is experiencing thoughts of suicide or self-harm.
Staff can access the employee assistance program. Resources are also available online at crisisservicescanada.ca, or you can connect to the national suicide prevention lifeline at 1-833-456-4566, or the Kids Help Phone at 1-800-668-6868.
On behalf of the committee, I want to thank you. Time management is always a bit of a challenge in this committee, but you have very graciously accommodated the joys of democracy. I want to thank you for your contribution to our study. It was very helpful.
With that, colleagues, the matter is adjourned.