Natural Resources Committee on Dec. 12th, 2006

[The Chair, Conservative, Lee Richardson]

Mr. Cullen, do you want to comment?

[Roy Cullen, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

I had a question.

The motion implicitly makes the point that there is some concern about some shortfall in the short-term funding to BIOCAP. Is it fair to say that the government agrees that this is an issue? Has the program been frozen, or cut, or...?

[The Chair, Conservative, Lee Richardson]

Yes, the previous government cut the funding, and there was a request to reinstate it. But I'm not sure that's relevant to the motion, or at least to the amendment, which is what we're discussing now.

[Roy Cullen, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

So the government doesn't dispute that there is a shortfall in short-term funding, no matter how it was caused?

[The Chair, Conservative, Lee Richardson]

There's nobody here to speak for the government, so....

[Roy Cullen, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

No, I was asking Mr. Paradis, through you, Mr. Chair.

[Christian Paradis, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

That’s precisely what I said, Mr. Chair. The only thing is that the long-term financing as of 2007 was problematic. As for the short-term financing, this is no problem.

[The Chair, Conservative, Lee Richardson]

C'est tout.

We are now speaking on the original motion, since the amendment has become the original motion because of the concurrence of the mover. So now we're talking about the BIOCAP motion, which was amended by Monsieur Paradis and agreed to by Mr. Tonks.

Madame DeBellefeuille, do you want to comment before we go to the question?

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

As a matter of fact, I ask myself a question. I’m not sure if I understood Mr. Paradis’ explanation in response to Mr. Cullen’s question on short-term financing. Can someone enlighten me as to what the connection is with Mr. Tonks’ motion? If I understand correctly, the government had made commitments, and this motion is asking the government to honour what is outstanding. Is this correct? I’m not sure I fully understand. Could Mr. Paradis explain this to me?

[Christian Paradis, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

We are talking about the current year.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

There were commitments for the current year and they are unsure about whether they want to meet them. The aim of this motion is to ask the government to meet them for the short-term, for the current year.

[A voice, Conservative, Jim Abbott]

This is just by way of a clarification.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Does this mean that there have been cuts?

[Christian Paradis, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

No, there were no cuts, but this had been decided beforehand.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

What do you mean by “beforehand?”

[Christian Paradis, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

A year ago. It created a vacuum, and we simply want the short-term commitments, in other words for the current year, to be restored. This is why, we asked that the reference to 2007-2008 be removed because it meant new financing. It’s just to fill in this vacuum.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

That’s fine.

Mr. Chair, there is one thing that bothers me: I find it odd that a committee like ours is discussing subsidies or financial support to a specific foundation. This really makes me uncomfortable. Every time that a foundation...

[The Chair, Conservative, Lee Richardson]

Then vote against it.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

I’m entitled to ask questions and to make comments. I think this is the right time to do so, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Lee Richardson]

As you wish.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Thank you.

I wonder if we need to politicize everything and favour one foundation over another, and discuss whether funds have been allocated or not. I have some doubts about this. I have not yet decided if I will support the amendment or not. I will wait until I hear other comments. Maybe Mr. Tonks would like to respond to the amendment.

[Alan Tonks, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

If I may, Mr. Chairman, I do appreciate Madame DeBellefeuille's problem. I can only relate that from time to time a constituent or a constituent group comes to me and says they've got a problem. I then try to take that problem to the committee, and that's what I'm doing.

The problem they have indicated is in writing. It's in the handout they gave, and I'm only going to quote from it:

BIOCAP is...seeking a positive decision on additional interim funding ($2M) that will enable the organization to fund the remainder of its programs and maintain the momentum that it has established over the past five years. BIOCAP has numerous outstanding research funding commitments ($950K in 2006-07; and $1.5M in 2007-09) to approximately 150 university researchers.

What I am suggesting, Mr. Chairman, is that they're saying they've already given the first part, and that this is the last part of their five-year program, and they don't have the money, they don't have the cashflow to continue with that research. The researchers have gone ahead, but they don't have the final commitment on the funding to honour those commitments. I'm simply saying let's leave it to the government to decide what the amount is, but in keeping with what I am told and what is in writing that BIOCAP had been given to understand was going to be their funding envelope. That's basically what it is—no more, no less.

I don't want to give the impression that I'm favouring one foundation. We simply listen to the merits of that foundation. I thought that since they were appearing before us today, we could see the niche they occupy, and hopefully the final part of their case will be taken up by the committee. There may be others that come before us that should be considered equally by the committee, but this just happens to be the one that's before us now, which was brought to my attention.

[The Chair, Conservative, Lee Richardson]

Technically, they've all been in front of us when the estimates have been in front of us. You can pick out any one you like and ask any question you like.

Mr. Tonks is just doing that outside of the estimates today. You're perfectly at liberty to raise these at any time you like, and we have lots of people who want to talk about it.

Monsieur Ouellet.

[Christian Ouellet, Bloc, Brome—Missisquoi, QC]

As a matter of fact, Mr. Chair, my question is related to what Mr. Tonks was saying. I would like to ask Mr. Paradis if he was aware of the fact that this subsidy was outstanding until we started discussing it here? Are there any other? As far as you know, are there other subsidies that are waiting to be renewed?

[Christian Paradis, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Mr. Chair, this is not question period. What I am saying is that when Mr. Tonks informed me of this, we realized that as far as the current year is concerned, there could be problems with regard to some commitments that had been made, no more no less. With the proposed amendment, the government recognizes that there could be commitments it has to honour so that the foundation is in a position to meet its own commitments. I have no intention of criticizing the Minister of Natural Resources nor of rewriting the programs. All I’m saying is that the proposed amendment is in line with Mr. Tonks’ concerns.