Evidence of meeting #12 for Natural Resources in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was home.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Ken Elsey  President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance
Martin Brunet  President and Certified Energy Advisor, Owner of Ottawa East Franchise, AmeriSpec
Victor Fiume  President, Canadian Home Builders' Association
Sheldon E. Busey  President, Shell Busey's HouseSmart Referral Network, As an Individual
Hans Brouillette  Director, Public Affairs and Communications, Corporation des propriétaires immobiliers du Québec
Stephen Koch  Executive Director, North American Insulation Manufacturers Association
Pascal Dubois  President, Legault-Dubois, Corporation des propriétaires immobiliers du Québec

9:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Alan Tonks

Good morning, everyone, members of the committee and witnesses. Welcome to the Hill, and welcome to the committee. We appreciate your presence.

Today we continue our study of the ecoENERGY programs. We're looking at the retrofit programs.

Our first panel of witnesses includes, from AmeriSpec, Mr. Martin Brunet, president and certified energy advisor and owner of the Ottawa east franchise. Welcome, Martin.

From the Canadian Home Builders' Association, we have Victor Fiume, president; John Kenward, chief operating officer; and David Foster, director of environmental affairs.

I think the video conference is for both panels. We have Mr. Ken Elsey.

Mr. Elsey, can you hear us okay?

9:05 a.m.

Ken Elsey President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance

I can indeed, sir. Thank you very much.

April 29th, 2010 / 9:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Alan Tonks

You're coming through loud and clear. We appreciate your being on the program.

Perhaps for Mr. Elsey, I'll just say we'll have our presentations, and then we'll go to the committee for questions. Presentations are seven or eight minutes, and then we have a round of questions for the balance of the hour.

The chair is not able to be here. He was on the road and not feeling well as a result of his travel. I'm going to try to fill in for him. Again, we welcome you.

Mr. Brunet, would you like to lead off, sir?

9:05 a.m.

Martin Brunet President and Certified Energy Advisor, Owner of Ottawa East Franchise, AmeriSpec

Certainly.

9:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Alan Tonks

We'll go to the top of the list.

Please make your presentation, and we will have questions.

Thank you.

9:05 a.m.

President and Certified Energy Advisor, Owner of Ottawa East Franchise, AmeriSpec

Martin Brunet

First, on behalf of AmeriSpec, I would like to express our sincerest gratitude to the committee for inviting us to participate in this study. Also, we regret the Canadian government's decision to conclude the ecoENERGY retrofit homes program. It is, in our opinion, a model energy efficiency program, and everyone at AmeriSpec has been tremendously proud to be a major contributor.

I have a couple of notes here. AmeriSpec employs over 300 people as a result of this program. AmeriSpec has performed over 190,000 home energy evaluations. We've participated in both home energy assessment programs--previously EnerGuide as well as ecoENERGY--and we also provide representation for ecoENERGY in all provinces excluding Quebec.

The ecoENERGY homes program has been especially notable with regard to the significant increase of knowledge and awareness of energy efficiency technologies available to homeowners. Canadians have also been able to significantly reduce their ecological footprint and save countless millions in energy costs. It has also spurred considerable job growth in the construction and manufacturing industries for energy-efficient products and services.

In addition, many other nations have embraced significant elements of the ecoENERGY retrofit homes program as their own, including its emphasis on obtaining the accurate measurement of home energy consumption. One such example is the Home Star program currently being considered by the United States Congress.

As it has been marked by so many successes, we urge the Government of Canada to view the ecoENERGY retrofit homes program not as a final step but as an initial one, an opportunity to explore the possibilities for achieving still greater energy savings. While the program has undeniably achieved a great deal, there is still much to be done. We feel that without the ecoENERGY homes program in place to aid Canadians in making the right choices about their homes, there will not continue to be the growth in and awareness of new energy efficient technologies as there has been for the program's duration.

Retailers and contractors providing these upgrades and services will likely find themselves in a similarly complicated situation. AmeriSpec and its associates across Canada appreciate having had the opportunity to play a noteworthy role in this highly successful energy conservation effort. We hope the Canadian government will reconsider and reinstate the program. We pledge to continue doing our part in contributing to the ecoENERGY homes retrofit program and look forward to continuing to work with the Government of Canada to create a brighter future for all Canadians.

In conclusion, here are some of the benefits this very effective and successful program has had: job creation in the form of several hundred new employment opportunities; economic stimulation; a reduction in greenhouse gases, which means a brighter future for our children; Canada doing its part to reduce global warming as a responsible nation on the world stage; and Canada making more efficient use of its resources.

Again we sincerely thank you for this opportunity.

9:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Alan Tonks

Thank you, Mr. Brunet. We appreciate that.

Who would like to lead off for the Canadian Home Builders' Association? Mr. Fiume? Thank you.

9:05 a.m.

Victor Fiume President, Canadian Home Builders' Association

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'm going to introduce John Kenward, the chief operating officer of the Canadian Home Builders' Association, who is with us this morning, and also David Foster, who is the association's director of environmental affairs.

I am Victor Fiume, and I am CHBA's national president. I'm also general manager of Durham Custom Homes in Oshawa, Ontario.

The Canadian Home Builders' Association represents Canada's residential construction industry. Our membership includes new home builders, renovators, developers, suppliers, trades, manufacturers, lenders, and other professionals. Today I would like to provide the committee with CHBA's views on the current ecoENERGY retrofit homes program. As well, I will address ongoing developments under way in Natural Resources Canada's Office of Energy Efficiency that are of great importance to new home builders, home renovators, and ultimately to Canadians.

The CHBA views these initiatives as a package; each element builds on the others, in a logical manner. The ecoENERGY retrofit homes program has been very popular with Canadians. It is a tremendous success. This initiative has played an important role in improving the energy efficiency of existing homes and in supporting Canada's economic action plan. The ecoENERGY retrofit homes program has been fully embraced by the home renovation sector, which is somewhat larger, in economic terms, than the new home building industry.

Home energy retrofit activities are delivering significant environmental results. In relation to energy use and greenhouse gas emissions, the residential sector is very much a leader in Canada, outperforming virtually every other sector. This record of success owes much to federal actions and initiatives. These have helped to inform Canadians about the importance of energy efficiency and encouraged them to take action. Perhaps equally important, these initiatives have helped to build capacity within our industry.

There are a number of new specialty trades working on our job sites today. These came about as a result of the move to increase energy efficiency in both new and existing homes. These are, in the full sense of the term, green jobs. This capacity is very important to Canada's long-term ability to address energy efficiency and climate change challenges.

We also note how the federal government has stimulated the introduction of complementary programs by many provinces and some utilities. For the CHBA, this outcome reinforces our belief in the importance of federal leadership in this area. Over the last year, a very high number of homeowners have undertaken pre-retrofit evaluations, peaking at approximately 50,000 per month. The CHBA recognizes that every pre-retrofit evaluation represents a contingent liability for the federal government, as it is linked to grant eligibility. So while the conclusion of the program's intake of new eligible homeowners came as a surprise to the CHBA, we view it not as a shift in policy but rather as a fiscal management action. It is the CHBA's view that the experience gained through the ecoENERGY retrofit homes program presents the federal government with a valuable opportunity to introduce new initiatives to support further energy efficiency improvements in the existing housing stock. There remains very significant energy efficiency potential in existing homes, and the job is far from done.

We understand that Natural Resources Canada has evaluations under way that will provide a comprehensive picture of the overall impacts of the ecoENERGY retrofit homes program. This information will be of considerable value in informing government decisions. The CHBA anticipates that following the completion of program evaluations in the next few months, the federal government will want to move forward with some urgency to develop plans for the next generation of the program so that this can be addressed in the next federal budget in early 2011. The importance of moving forward expeditiously on the next generation of the ecoENERGY retrofit homes program is linked both to the importance of maintaining momentum with homeowners and to sustaining professional capacity within the private sector.

In moving forward, it will be important to continue to bear in mind that a house is a system. As we make changes to heating systems, the building envelope, or other major components, there can often be secondary effects for such elements as natural ventilation or changes to air and moisture flows within building envelopes. It will be important to ensure that “house as a system” thinking is built into the design of the new initiative.

I should note that there are a number of development initiatives already under way. These include next-generation versions of the R-2000 standard, Energy Star for new homes, and the EnerGuide rating system. The next-generation R-2000 standard will update this valuable initiative and restore it to its intended position as leading edge among voluntary, market-driven, new-home initiatives.

It is expected that the new R-2000 standard will require energy performance that is 50% better than that required by building codes. This will both stimulate increased innovation within our industry and help to diffuse these new technologies and building practices to the entire industry.

The next generation of Energy Star for new homes will provide production new home builders with an accessible and marketable option for building higher performance into new homes, delivering performance about 25% better than building codes require.

Energy Star has been a tremendous success. In my home province of Ontario, in a little more than two years it has captured 22% of the market--an impressive accomplishment. As a committed Energy Star builder myself, I look forward to seeing the Energy Star brand build on this strength.

Finally, the next generation EnerGuide rating system, or ERS, will play a critical role in all future energy efficiency initiatives for both new and existing homes. ERS will allow us to measure and verify home energy performance, and it will provide homebuyers with a clear and transparent tool for comparing any two homes.

The next generation ERS will be far more robust, supporting provincial jurisdictions wishing to mandate a mandatory energy rating for all homes sold, new or existing.

The CHBA sees an exciting opportunity to set Canada on an even stronger path when it comes to future directions for the energy efficiency of homes, particularly existing homes.

The entire package of energy efficiency initiatives supported by the federal government offers tremendous potential. Today, within our industry, what is good for the environment is well aligned with what is good for our economy and for the health and well-being of Canadians.

We have a very solid foundation to build upon, due in no small part to federal involvement through the Office of Energy Efficiency and the federal initiatives I have mentioned this morning. We need to build on this capacity.

Thank you.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Alan Tonks

Thank you, Mr. Fiume.

I think I neglected to introduce Mr. Elsey, from the Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance. He is the president and CEO.

Mr. Elsey, we welcome you. If you'd like to make a little presentation, the floor is now yours.

9:15 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance

Ken Elsey

Thank you very much, Mr. Tonks.

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. I'm very sorry that I'm not able to be there with you this morning, but I've got a few other meetings this afternoon that I couldn't change.

I'll give you just a brief overview of who I represent. The Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance is a broad-based, not-for-profit organization. We were established in 1995 to respond to the lack of a coordinated effort to promote energy efficiency in Canada.

We are heavily involved in the development of the energy efficiency codes and standards--from building codes for your home, to your appliances, and even to the electric vehicle that will one day be parked in your driveway.

The CEEA, Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance, participates internationally on strategic working groups dealing in energy efficiency, both with the International Electrotechnical Commission, more commonly known as the IEC, as well as the ISO, the International Standards Organization. Through these organizations, we make recommendations to the IEA, the International Energy Agency. They in turn make recommendations to the G8, of which Canada is a signatory.

In the most recent report published by the IEA in 2009, they noted that Canada's primary energy and electricity consumption per unit of GDP is the highest among IEA countries. However, they're quite optimistic in their tone when they go on to say that Canada is committed to working to increase energy efficiency. In August 2008, individual Canadian provinces and territories committed to achieving a 20% increase in energy efficiency by 2020, largely through the improvement of building codes, broader regulations of energy-using appliances, and green policies for new government-funded facilities. And most importantly, noted in the IEA report was the reference to home energy audits and retrofit assistance.

In addition to this, the federal and provincial governments are collaborating in ways to achieve combined energy efficiency objectives. Provincial and territorial governments are using the federal energy efficiency tools to complement their own energy efficiency programs and policies. It must therefore be realized that the cancellation of the federal ecoENERGY program is a serious blow to the provincial and territorial goals to achieve this 20% increase in energy efficiency by 2020. It's also a failure to maintain the recommendations of the IEA to increase investments in energy efficiency and to create more favourable grounds for private energy efficiency investment.

The ecoENERGY program did this by encouraging Canadians to invest in their own homes. The ecoENERGY program was successful in its own right. While the program has expended $300,543,296 to February 1, 2010, it will likely grow to over $750 million by its conclusion in March 2011. We estimate that this figure will represent only 15% of the total expenditures made by Canadians. Canadians themselves will have invested over $4 billion as a result of this program. Those figures are based solely on the federal numbers. With most provinces having a matching program, the total spend will likely exceed this significantly.

While the average rebate for an ecoENERGY home is only $1,274, we've also concluded that most Canadians have not taken full advantage of the energy savings identified through their audits. So we see the future work being done as consumers recognize the potential as energy costs continue to escalate.

However, the energy savings achieved to February 1 of this year are very impressive. While we believe NRCan's estimates may be a little on the high side, they show 11.22 petajoules of energy having been saved.

Maybe everybody is not familiar with a petajoule, so let me convert that. I do understand there is an issue between natural gas and electricity, but to understand the scope of the opportunity, let's just deal with electricity. One petajoule, in electricity terms, equals 277,780,000 kilowatt hours of energy. That means 11.22 petajoules equals 3,116,000,000 kilowatt hours of energy. You get the picture.

The total weighted average cost of electricity in Canada—and we've done this study extensively—is 10.9¢ per kilowatt hour. This includes all costs, everything from delivery charges, transportation fees, debt retirement charges, and taxes.

Therefore, before the annual total savings to Canadians, based on the NRCan's results to date, show that Canadians will save $339,719,384 per year, every year going forward. All of this is likely to be reinvested in our economy, or lowering household debt. The GHG savings are also significant. While there are some regional variances, NRCan has shown a total cumulative GHG savings of 743,416 tonnes per year. This is really a very impressive target, and it's in line with their goal of 743,750 tonnes for the 2009-10 year.

While these achievements of the program are impressive, they may be a little conservative, the reason being that of the 800,142 audits completed, only 236,000 represent second audits, which would in fact qualify the homeowner for the rebate. There are some 564,137 audits that are likely to move to second audit. While conversion rates now average only 41.8%--that is the homeowner requesting a second audit following the work in order to qualify for the rebate--our discussions with auditors indicate that this will rapidly escalate as the deadline approaches. Many of the auditors we've talked to suggest that the conversion rate will exceed 80%. While this will have serious cost implications to the program, it also means that energy savings will be greater than forecast.

From an economic perspective, if we're to look at the business case for ecoENERGY, it's one that's easy to justify. First, from the federal government's perspective, if our assumptions are correct and the program generates close to $5 billion in total spending, that spend represents $250 million in GST revenue alone.

While the $5 billion cannot be directly translated into jobs, annex 1 of the 2009 budget suggests that there is a relationship between GDP and jobs. Assuming only 5,000 jobs are created or maintained as a result of the program, with an average salary of $40,000 and a 15% federal tax rate, the contribution credit to the program is about $30 million. Thus, the current spend of forecasted $750 million is offset by revenue of almost $3 million.

9:20 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Alan Tonks

Mr. Elsey, I'm sorry to interrupt you. You have one minute.

9:20 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance

Ken Elsey

Fine. I'll move to a conclusion.

The issue we face is that the federal government is looking at it as an expense, not as an investment. It should be viewed as an investment with significant returns. Energy efficiency is as important, even more so, than the automakers' bailout of a year ago, and energy efficiency will continue to repay over and over again, both in terms of jobs and a greener economy. I would respectfully request that the program be reinstated, or at least redeveloped, with the same intent.

Thank you.

9:25 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Alan Tonks

Thank you for that, Mr. Elsey. I'm sorry I had to interrupt you, but we try to get to questions so we have an opportunity to extract some additional information and clarification.

We'll start off with questions from Mr. Regan, from the opposition.

9:25 a.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you to the witnesses for coming today and for being with us from Toronto.

Mr. Elsey, in relation to your comments—and thank you for your very detailed comments about the numbers—in view of the situation, and the cost of the remaining second audits to be done, do you think there's enough money in the system to do them? Will people end up not being able to get reimbursed?

9:25 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance

Ken Elsey

I think that's a commitment the government has made, to continue to March 2011. I think they will see the economics of it come back in a positive way. This is only going to be a continued stimulus to the economy in a very positive light, providing the consumers with the savings they will reinvest in the economy as well.

The big issue is that this really does put money back into the pockets of Canadians for further development of products and services.

9:25 a.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Mr. Elsey, we heard on Tuesday from the solar sector that distributors and sellers are already leaving their industry, with the apparent demise of this program. They're telling us that people who were about to invest substantial amounts are in fact walking away. They feel there's going to be a brain drain to the U.S.

Are you seeing the same thing, or do you foresee the same thing, unless this is renewed?

9:25 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Energy Efficiency Alliance

Ken Elsey

There are two issues. One is, I have already heard of a number of auditors being laid off or given notice that they will be laid off. We've also been talking to the colleges that are developing training programs. The question is whether we should be developing some of these training programs, if the opportunity for employment seems to be less when their students graduate. There's real concern in various sectors of the economy, not just on the energy side.

9:25 a.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Thank you.

Mr. Brunet, in addition to that question, we've heard that a lot of businesses were making investments and spending money to attract new customers just days before, maybe even the day of, the coming out of news on March 31 that this program was going to end--before it was killed by the Conservatives. Are people angry that the government didn't give them some kind of warning for this?

9:25 a.m.

President and Certified Energy Advisor, Owner of Ottawa East Franchise, AmeriSpec

Martin Brunet

Definitely there was a lot of upset. People were calling me, especially in the days following—those who missed the opportunity to register before the program closed.

9:25 a.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

You've worked in the program. Obviously you know it intimately. You've dealt with homeowners who were going through this process. What do you feel has been the benefit to homeowners of this program?

9:25 a.m.

President and Certified Energy Advisor, Owner of Ottawa East Franchise, AmeriSpec

Martin Brunet

For one thing, a lot of homeowners were not aware of the various energy efficient products available to them. As a result of going into their homes and presenting them with the options, opportunities, and incentives on the choices they could make, I found that a lot of homes made various changes to become more efficient, even outside of what they were initially planning on doing. For example, if they were replacing their heating system, after meeting with one of our energy auditors they would also replace their toilets and their air conditioner and perhaps some windows, making their house even more efficient and, as a result of that, stimulating some work for some of those other contractors, who benefited from that visit.

9:25 a.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

We keep hearing from government members that the program isn't really cancelled but just under review and that of course it will continue until March 2011. My question is, does anyone in the industry actually believe that's true?

9:25 a.m.

President and Certified Energy Advisor, Owner of Ottawa East Franchise, AmeriSpec

Martin Brunet

I hope so. I think this is the kind of initiative that should be permanent, or at least long-term: something that continues to grow with products as they advance in energy efficiency, so that geothermal systems or solar systems can become more affordable to the average homeowner and so that at some point we can have a really sophisticated sort of network whereby we are helping homeowners continuously save energy and perhaps one day can fuel the whole country on renewable energy.

9:25 a.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Mr. Fiume, were there any problems with this program that justified cancelling it, in your view? Was it being abused? Was it working? Was it popular?

9:25 a.m.

President, Canadian Home Builders' Association

Victor Fiume

Certainly it was popular. I think the reality is that we don't look at this as a cancellation of a program, but as an opportunity to work with the government to bring about another program that will be better than what we had. We're really excited about that opportunity.

I think the reality is that we all have to do more with less. The exciting part of our working with the government on this is the opportunity to bring about an even wider range of products and initiatives that are at considerably less cost and to use the savings that are brought about by new products and new systems to fund further investment by the homeowners in their homes.