Natural Resources Committee on Nov. 27th, 2012

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

No, we're going to deal with the proposed amendment.

[Claude Gravelle, NDP, Nickel Belt, ON]

May I get the clarification afterward?

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

If we ever get away from the motion, yes, you may.

Let's go to the vote on the amendment, then.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

I ask for a recorded vote.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

It's a recorded division.

(Amendment negatived: nays, 6; yeas, 5 [See Minutes of Proceedings])

Can we go to the vote on the main motion now?

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Chair, you would be disappointed if I didn't have another amendment, wouldn't you?

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

No, I would not be at all, Mr. McKay.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

I'm shocked. I'm perfectly happy to adjourn the meeting. If you have other business to do, I'm perfectly happy that you adjourn the meeting, but if not, then I do have another amendment, Chair.

If the committee is apparently not interested in Alison Redford, the Premier of Alberta, who probably has more influence—

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Is there a point of order, Mr. Julian?

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

I'd like to move that the meeting be adjourned, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

There's been a motion to adjourn the meeting. I'll go straight to the question.

Those in favour of the meeting being adjourned early—

[David Anderson, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Just a minute. You can't move a motion on a point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Oh, that's right, of course not. Thank you, Mr. Anderson.

Of course it's out of order, Mr. Julian. Besides, we're dealing with a motion, and the motion is on the floor right now. The chair let that slip.

Are there any other proposed amendments?

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

I'd like to propose, Mr. Chair, that the meeting be adjourned.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

We're dealing with a motion. There's a motion before the committee. I can't accept that.

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

Yes, you can, actually, Mr. Chair.

I think that if you consult the clerk, you'll find that it is in order, not on a point of order, but in the place of an amendment.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

I will have a discussion on that. I'm not certain about it.

That motion is in order, Mr. Julian. Let's go to the vote on the motion to adjourn.

(Motion negatived: nays 6; yeas 5)

Now, we go back to the vote on the main motion.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

I had no idea, Mr. Chair, that my Conservative colleagues were so enthusiastic to hear what I had to say. It's a remarkable turn of events.

Having turned down now the Minister of Natural Resources, the Minister of Finance, the Minister of International Trade, the Minister of the Environment, the minister of western diversification, and the Premier of Alberta, why don't we try Christy Clark, out in British Columbia?

Let's do Christy Clark, Premier of British Columbia.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

I want to know exactly what you're proposing here.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

I just replaced the Premier of Alberta with the Premier of British Columbia.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Go ahead, Mr. Anderson.

[David Anderson, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

I think we're going to ask you to rule this out of order.

Mr. McKay is simply doing this to try to delay. These are frivolous suggested amendments to the motion. I'm going to ask you to rule that amendments in this fashion are out of order, since he's not taking this seriously any longer.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

We have an expert helping us here today, an expert besides our normal clerk.

I asked her to look at the issue that I had brought up, which was that an amendment is out of order procedurally if it raises a question substantially the same as one that has been ruled on in the same session. I don't know how this has been handled in the past. I'd like to see what the committee clerk, Isabelle, has to say. Let's have a little discussion on this.

Mr. McKay, this is your second proposal in terms of amendments. You've requested in your amendment that the Premier of Alberta come before the committee and now you're requesting the Premier of British Columbia. If there is a third request, I'll have to make a ruling on that, because you're raising a question substantially the same as the one that we've already dealt with. I don't want to presume what you're going to do, but let's go to the discussion on this proposed amendment first.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

There is a substantive difference between the Premier of Alberta and the Premier of British Columbia, and how either of them could be confused as being similar in any way, shape, or form, escapes me altogether. If you were to ask Christy Clark and Alison Redford about the similarities between them, I dare say you might get a bit of an earful.

Nevertheless, this is a big country, and the Premier of British Columbia is responsible for a whole variety of energy sources.The one that is of most relevance to this study would be the pipeline that goes from the energy sources in Alberta out to the coastline. Were the committee to have Christy Clark, the Premier of British Columbia, in to the committee, she would have a very strong view on the substance of the motion as opposed to its froth, particularly the economic benefits that flow from Alberta's energy sector.

I recollect her saying in the newspaper, on television, and elsewhere, “How is it that Alberta gets all of the benefits and British Columbia takes on all of the liabilities?” I don't know whether that is or is not true. I don't know whether British Columbia would actually not derive any benefits. They certainly have a heightened risk in transporting this oil across what is otherwise pristine wilderness. There is certainly a heightened risk in loading from a pipeline into the ships, and there is a heightened risk in getting the ships into the ocean to go to their ultimate destination.

There has been a great deal of conversation on this matter, and I can't imagine that you wouldn't want to invite her or that you wouldn't want to see her in place of Mr. Trudeau or Mr. McGuinty if the committee were serious about Alberta's energy sector.

Were it up to me, I would think that all of the previous persons I have proposed would be of great significance to any serious study about energy in this country.

Oops, I didn't wake anybody up, did I?

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

No, I heard what you said.

Is there any further discussion on this proposed amendment?

Go ahead, Mr. Nicholls.