Natural Resources Committee on Dec. 2nd, 2013

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

Excuse me, Mr. Labonté.

Is there any documentation—

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

No, Mr. Julian.

There is no more time for a follow-up question.

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

If you have any information you can share with us, e-mails, or anything internally, on the issue of the safety regulator, please do so.

[Jeff Labonté]

I'm sorry, were you looking for further information from e-mails?

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

If you have any information internally on the evaluation around the safety regulator that you could share with us, it would be appreciated.

[Jeff Labonté]

We have a regular dialogue with our colleagues in the provinces of Newfoundland and Labrador and Nova Scotia, with the offshore boards, and with the regulatory community globally. We address the issues and try to move forward with health and safety issues around the workplace to make sure that it remains a priority. We continue to discuss with the province Mr. Wells' recommendations and the broader context around occupational health and safety, both of the workplace and of the operations.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Julian.

Thanks to all of you from the Department of Natural Resources and from the Department of Employment and Social Development Canada for being here today and helping us with the start of our examination of this legislation.

Thank you very much.

I will suspend the meeting for a couple of minutes as we change witnesses.

I would ask anyone who would like to talk to these witnesses if you could please move away from the back of the table to do that so the new witnesses can come to the table. This would allow the maximum amount of time possible with the witnesses from the two provinces.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Good afternoon, everyone. I will reconvene the meeting.

We have two witnesses.

From the Canada-Newfoundland and Labrador Offshore Petroleum Board, we have Scott Tessier, chair and chief executive officer. Scott, when you make your presentation, you can introduce the person you have with you.

We also have, from the Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Board, Stuart Pinks, chief executive officer.

Thank you very much, all of you, for coming on such short notice. We really do appreciate it.

We're looking forward to hearing what you have to say and then to hearing your answers to the questions committee members have for you.

We will go in the order you're listed on the agenda, starting with Scott Tessier.

[Scott Tessier, Chair and Chief Executive Officer, Canada-Newfoundland and Labrador Offshore Petroleum Board]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good afternoon. I am the chair and chief executive officer of the Canada-Newfoundland and Labrador Offshore Petroleum Board, sometimes referred to as the C-NLOPB. I am joined by my colleague, Susan Gover, legal counsel with the board. It's a pleasure for us to be here today to speak in favour of this very important bill.

The C-NLOPB is pleased that Bill C-5 has been introduced in Parliament. We see it as a very positive development in offshore safety. In particular, we appreciate that the bill reflects the following principles: occupational health and safety laws for the Newfoundland and Labrador offshore area should be at least as stringent as those for onshore; joint jurisdiction of both the federal and provincial governments is recognized; and consideration has been given to an effective and efficient use of regulatory resources.

I want to acknowledge the tremendous effort that has gone into this initiative over a number of years by our staff, in particular Howard Pike and Susan Gover, who joins me today. They've brought great value to the development of this package through their expertise and their advice to government officials.

Bill C-5 is an important piece of legislation in that it extends authority and fundamental principles of occupational health and safety to the offshore within the accord acts. These new amendments will provide a comprehensive legal framework to achieve the same protections for offshore workers that onshore workers currently enjoy.

The passage of this bill into legislation would strengthen the way in which we and our colleagues in Nova Scotia conduct offshore safety activities. These amendments create a formal legislative and regulatory framework for occupational health and safety and a more effective enforcement tool kit for our officers.

One of the significant changes proposed in the bill is on matters related to occupational health and safety. The C-NLOPB will also now report directly to the provincial minister responsible, the Minister of Service Newfoundland and Labrador. We look forward to that new working relationship.

The bill also reflects a hierarchy of responsibility in clarifying the roles of governments, regulators, employers, and employees. It recognizes that the operator is ultimately responsible for ensuring worker safety in the offshore environment.

Bill C-5 also grants the offshore petroleum boards additional authority to disclose information to the public related to occupational health and safety. The C-NLOPB is committed to the principles of openness, accountability, and transparency, and we are committed to continuous improvement in this regard. These amendments will guide the C-NLOPB in our decision-making around information disclosure on matters of offshore safety that are in the public interest.

The C-NLOPB would also welcome the establishment of an advisory council with representatives from industry, governments, and employees to provide advice on matters related to occupational health and safety.

As well, the new legislation will clarify any jurisdictional uncertainties respecting occupational health and safety matters, in particular the right to refuse and the requirement for occupational health and safety committees. The C-NLOPB currently administers the provisions of the provincial Occupational Health and Safety Act on behalf of the province. Having these principles enshrined in legislation under the accord will ensure that the board has clearer authority to enforce all occupational health and safety requirements.

In October the board held its fifth safety forum, which provided an opportunity for stakeholders in the offshore industry to share information so that safety issues can be proactively identified and discussed. Many of the issues that arose related to matters addressed in the proposed amendments. The following day we held our biannual meeting with the joint occupational health and safety committees from each of the facilities operating offshore. The committees reviewed an overview of the changes proposed in Bill C-5, and the response was quite positive.

An important feature of these amendments is that they ensure the new occupational health and safety regime clearly applies to workers in transit to, from, or between offshore workplaces. This would require that the federal Minister of Transport recommend regulations related to the occupational health and safety of offshore workers in transit. Transport Canada has regulatory responsibility for vessels and helicopters, but the C-NLOPB has an important role in passenger safety with respect to offshore workers. It's therefore important that both regulatory agencies adopt a coordinated approach to safe passenger travel to, from, and between offshore facilities.

Since the crash of Cougar flight 491 and the establishment of the Wells inquiry by the C-NLOPB, there have been considerable improvements to offshore helicopter passenger safety. The actions of the C-NLOPB following this tragedy have captured the interest of offshore regulators worldwide.

I, along with our chief safety officer, recently returned from an international offshore safety conference, where we gave an overview to a very attentive audience about our progress on helicopter safety.

I think it's fair to say that out of these tragic circumstances we are among the world leaders in offshore helicopter passenger safety. The proposed legislative amendments will further strengthen Canada’s leadership in this area.

In response to the Wells report, the C-NLOPB established an implementation team consisting of offshore workers, operators, Cougar Helicopters, and the C-NLOPB. While very good progress has been made in implementing the recommendations of the Wells inquiry, more work remains to be done by a number of stakeholders.

I'll close by saying that the safety of offshore workers is always our top priority. The C-NLOPB welcomes these amendments, and we will be ready to implement them once they are passed by Parliament.

I want to thank you for inviting us here today and for giving us this opportunity to speak to this important legislative proposal.

I look forward to your questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Thank you very much, Mr. Tessier, for your presentation.

We will go now to the presentation from Stuart Pinks, chief executive officer, Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Board.

Please go ahead with your presentation, sir.

[Stuart Pinks, Chief Executive Officer, Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Board]

Okay.

Mr. Chair, and members, thank you for the invitation for the Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Board, what we call the C-NSOPB, to appear before the Standing Committee on Natural Resources regarding Bill C-5, the offshore health and safety act.

My name is Stuart Pinks and I am the board’s chief executive officer.

The C-NSOPB is the independent joint agency of the governments of Canada and Nova Scotia responsible for the regulation of petroleum activities in the Nova Scotia offshore area. In carrying out its legislative mandate, the health and safety of offshore workers is paramount, and it is with this in mind that the board is pleased to be able to communicate to this committee the board’s support for Bill C-5.

While both the federal and provincial governments acknowledged the need for legislative change, the board took interim steps a number of years ago and developed its own set of occupational health and safety requirements based on a hybrid of best practices from existing provincial and federal legislation and regulations. At the heart of these requirements is an internal responsibility system which, among other aspects, promotes a positive safety culture, the use of best practices, and holds both employers and employees accountable for safety.

Our current health and safety structure ensures that petroleum activities are conducted in a manner in which hazards are properly identified, and the associated risks assessed and then appropriately mitigated and managed. The board’s health and safety team is led by our chief safety officer, Mr. Keith Landra, who alongside me is appointed by and reports directly to the board. Reporting to Mr. Landra are several health, safety, and environment advisers, some of whom are also designated as safety officers under the current legislation. One of these safety officers has been designated as a backup to Mr. Landra in his capacity as chief safety officer, should he be unable to fulfill his role at any given time.

As a former chief safety officer at the board myself, I know first-hand the importance of having in place the appropriate organizational structure to assure that our decision-making process recognizes safety as paramount and environmental protection as a close second. I am pleased to say that our board has in place a governance structure to assure that this is indeed the case, and that to this end they have created a separate board committee responsible for oversight of our health, safety, and environmental, HSE, protection mandate.

This committee consists of board members with extensive offshore oil and gas experience and expertise. It meets regularly with our chief safety officer ahead of all board meetings and also on an as-needed basis. These meetings are designed to give the chief safety officer regular and direct access to the board members in support of his very important role, separate from consideration of other aspects of the board’s mandate.

The HSE committee has a number of functions, which include reviewing decisions taken to assure that decision-making recognizes the paramountcy of health and safety. The committee also supports the chief safety officer in his role and provides advice as and when necessary. Another key benefit of the committee is that it acts as a system of checks and balances to ensure that all the appropriate policies, systems, guidelines, and memoranda of understanding are in place for ensuring regulatory due diligence, and that health and safety efforts are adequately resourced.

While our current occupational health and safety system has served us well, we welcome the changes in part III.1. Board staff has been integrally involved in the legislative drafting process, providing advice on an ongoing basis. We are encouraged to see that this legislation contains the legal framework and authority for a modern occupational health and safety regime in the offshore. We are pleased to see that the compliance and investigation powers of our occupational health and safety, operational safety, and conservation officers have been modernized and made consistent in that legislation.

Another benefit of this legislation surrounds transparency. As a regulator of a high-profile industry, we are frequently challenged with the task of releasing information. These new legislative amendments will ensure that we can disclose information related to occupational health and safety should it be in the public interest.

Last, our board strongly feels that each person has a responsibility for the overall safety of the workplace. Owners, interest holders, operators, employers, supervisors, service providers, and front-line employees each have individual and shared responsibilities. Because this hierarchy is outlined in this bill, our board can make greater strides in directing and enforcing responsibility.

Furthermore, we are pleased to see that this bill legally enshrines employee rights to know, to participate, to refuse dangerous work, and to be protected from reprisal. It is my belief that these changes will help to foster a greater sense of safety culture in Nova Scotia’s offshore.

Moving forward, our board will work with both governments to create memoranda of understanding for the administration and enforcement of part III.1 and part III of the legislation. Our designated officers will be appropriately trained, and we will make the necessary changes to our internal policies and procedures. Our HSE committee has proved to be an important function of the board and will continue to provide governance oversight as we move forward in implementing these amendments. Our staff will also work to inform operators and staff of these changes.

Overall, our board welcomes this legislation and looks forward to seeing its benefits realized.

Thank you again for the opportunity to provide the board’s perspective on this matter.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Thank you very much, Mr. Pinks, for your presentation.

We'll start with Mr. Allen. We need a New Democratic member, and Mr. Regan.

Go ahead, please, Mr. Allen.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, folks, for being here. I appreciate your insight and input into this bill.

One of the comments you both made was with respect to transparency. Mr. Pinks, one of the comments you made was that as a regulator of a high-profile industry, you are frequently challenged with releasing information. It was the same thing with Newfoundland. You said these new amendments would provide a comprehensive legal framework to achieve the same protections.

Can you comment about that release of information and transparency? What are the benefits of Bill C-5 that you didn't have before?

[Stuart Pinks]

Maybe I can take the first stab at answering the question and then pass it over to Scott for any additional comments.

Just about all of the information that our board receives in its day-to-day regulation of operators is deemed to be proprietary information. It's protected under the act, as it currently is worded, from release into the public domain. It can be released to governments on request, but it cannot be released into the public domain without the express permission of the operator that provided that information.

Those provisions were put in back in the 1980s when the legislation was first drafted. In this day and age, there is an expectation that the public is better informed on occupational health and safety matters and environmental matters. The legislative amendments contained within this bill provide the ability of the board to release information specifically on the health and safety side if the key safety officer determines that the information will be of benefit to the public. This means more information can be shared in the public domain. Lessons learned from incidents can be broadcast and learned by others. We see this as a primary benefit in improving safety in the offshore.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Mr. Tessier.

[Scott Tessier]

To reiterate, both the federal and provincial ministers are entitled to information or documents related to occupational health and safety. That's under the control of the board upon their request. The boards have discretionary power and responsibility to release health and safety information that's in the public interest. The chief safety officer may also disclose information with respect to occupational health and safety to government officials and agencies and foreign governments if it's in the interest of public health and safety.

Both boards are committed to the principles of transparency, accountability, and openness, and we are committed to continuous improvement in that regard. Certainly, in the Newfoundland and Labrador environment, because of the tragedies of the past, the Ocean Ranger and Cougar flight 491, which have both been mentioned here today, there is a keen interest in transparency on the part of the general public in Newfoundland and Labrador.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Let's go to the chief safety officer, then. I see both of you have your chief safety officers in place. How are those people selected? For how long will they serve?

With the chief safety officer being part of the board, do you see the chance of a conflict? In my previous history in construction, the chief safety officer could pretty well shut down anything he wanted if it was dangerous, and he can shut down a developer.

I want to ask three questions. How are they appointed? For how long do they serve? Do you see any issues of accountability and transparency in respect of that role?

[Stuart Pinks]

I can start from a Nova Scotia perspective.

The chief safety officer role has a lot of defined qualification and competency requirements. Typically that individual will be a 20-plus year individual with extensive offshore experience and extensive experience at managing human resources, the people who would be assisting him and advising him.

That individual is selected through a rigorous procedure that we have in place at the board staff level. A recommendation would go to the board to appoint the chief safety officer, and the board would make that appointment.

I think in the 25-odd years our board has been in existence, we've only had four or five chief safety officers. They tend to stay in that position for an extended period of time.

Actually, I myself was a chief safety officer previously. I only relinquished that position when I became the chief executive officer.

In terms of independence, first of all, in terms of any authorization that is issued for any work or activity in the offshore, the chief safety officer must be consulted. The chief safety officer is obligated to consider safety in its entirety and to make a recommendation to the board, or the chief executive officer on behalf of the board, as to whether an authorization should be issued, yes or no. I think in the 12 years I've been at the board, the chief safety officer's recommendation has been accepted in every case.

Once an authorization has been issued, the chief safety officer then has the ultimate authority. As has been discussed, if there is an operation that is unsafe and could cause serious bodily injury, the chief safety officer has the authority, as does the safety officer, to shut down the work site. Once the chief safety officer has issued the order, or validated the order issued by a safety officer, that is only challengeable in the court. It's not reviewable by me, as chief executive officer, and it's not reviewable by the board.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Mr. Tessier.

[Scott Tessier]

I'll add that following the Wells report, the C-NLOPB clarified the role of the chief safety officer. The terms of reference for that position are available online.

The board took further measures to separate the safety function within the board, consistent with recommendation 29(b) from Judge Wells. At that time there was an extensive public search to identify and recruit the chief safety officer, who's still in place, and as to the term, the longer the better, as far as I'm concerned, with respect to our current CSO.

In terms of the question of conflict, or the optics of conflict, as I mentioned in my opening statement, safety is always our top priority. I've only been in the position for about nine months, but it's hard for me to conceive of a situation wherein the word of the CSO would not be paramount in any board decision.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

This legislation brings the yardsticks forward. Do you see anything in here—you took me to my next question when you brought up the Wells report—that would prevent long-term discussion, or immediate-term discussion, with the provinces on Mr. Wells' recommendation on a different form of structure? Do you see anything in this legislation that would stop us from getting there someday if we wanted to?

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

There's time for a very brief answer from each of you.

[Stuart Pinks]

No. I would say no. This deals strictly with occupational health and safety, which is alongside the operational safety that proposed part III.1 deals with. Now you have safety as an overall umbrella and that discussion could proceed.

[Scott Tessier]

The establishment of the advisory council, as you mentioned, does move the yardsticks forward in this regard as well.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Thank you very much, Mr. Allen.

We'll go to Mr. Julian, for up to seven minutes.