Natural Resources Committee on April 30th, 2026

[Mario Simard, Bloc, Jonquière, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Pivnick, I'm going to come back to you to give you the opportunity to participate in the discussion we were having earlier.

I was talking to Mr. Côté about the possibility of implementing an industrial policy on electrification. I'd like to tie this back to your opening remarks, in which you talked about the volatility of fossil fuel prices. I keep seeing articles showing how China—not out of interest in climate change, but probably because they're concerned about their energy security—is making big strides in electrification, and how it's likely putting in place a highly developed industrial policy on electrification on a number of fronts.

If we were to take that route, what would the best short-term solution look like? What government actions could be taken?

[Evan Pivnick]

Absolutely. Thank you for the question.

I think it's worth pointing out that when it comes to the volatile prices, North America can feel like a bit of an island because, when you look around the rest of the world, they are responding to this as a transformational moment. With the price shocks and the costs to consumers on electricity bills, this is a moment when they are rapidly looking to make massive changes, and I just wanted to highlight that for a moment.

When it comes to industrial policy, we're already seeing right across the board demand for electricity from industries. Let's just take critical minerals. If you talk to the mining sector, they say, “Give us access to renewables. Give us access to low-cost, clean electricity to power our mine sites.” It means that they don't have to import fuel. It means that they can be connected to a reliable electricity grid to power operations and, increasingly, that runs the gamut of the full operations. That's another space where we see economic opportunities for applying electrified technologies.

I'd say the priority for an industrial electrification strategy is moving to abundance. We have had a bit of a scarcity mindset when it comes to the electricity system. We build when demand comes. Right now, we're in this contest of how much demand there is and building precisely for the moment and not building ahead. That's not what other countries are doing when it comes to securing investments. They're building ahead knowing that demand is on its way and that key to attracting investment is to be able to offer that in advance to secure those investments. That's not an easy gamut. Certainly, utilities are going to have to navigate some challenging uncertainty with that, but that's a key piece of being able to unlock a true industrial electrification strategy.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Thank you to you both.

Mr. Martel, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Mario Simard, Bloc, Jonquière, QC]

Mr. Chair, I would like the witness to submit his answer in writing.

Mr. Pivnick, if you have any information to send me in writing, I'd be happy to receive it.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

That's right, and all of our witnesses are welcome to submit additional material. We welcome briefs. Thank you so much.

Mr. Martel, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Pivnick, in 2026, Germany continues to massively subsidize its electricity industry because of the high costs of its energy transition policy. Doesn't that demonstrate the structural limitations of a model that's highly dependent on intermittent renewables, as well as the limitations associated with energy availability far from major centres?

[Evan Pivnick]

When we look at the EU, they are among the countries, the regions, the trading blocs, that are most rapidly trying to embrace electrification, and they're doing so quickly in response to not one but two global conflicts that have fundamentally changed what they think they can rely on when it comes to their energy supply chains.

That rapid shift has all sorts of short-term impacts. They're out looking to meet short-term needs across a wide variety of energy resources, but long term, these conflicts are one of the drivers in the EU pushing for increasing the ambition to develop homegrown energy resources. That's based in renewables. That's looking at battery storage, which, to the previous discussion, Canada's falling behind on because it's seeing widespread deployment globally that unlocks renewables to an even further degree.

I can't speak to the specific subsidization in Germany's electricity sector, but certainly the focus on electrification and removing their exposure to volatile fossil fuel prices is a priority.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

In a scenario of sharply rising energy demand in Canada, how can we think about excluding oil and natural gas from the energy portfolio over the next 40 years?

[Evan Pivnick]

The way I would put it is that Canada should be doing everything it can to maximize the share of new energy demand that it uses renewables, battery storage and other clean sources to meet. That will allow us to be more secure when it comes to building a wind turbine, when it comes to solar power and when it comes to hydro. Those are resources that are accessible here. Those aren't reliant on any global supply chain for the actual power generation aspect. This is a key difference between the clean and conventional supply chains. For conventional, you need the constant import of fuel. When it comes to clean, once the technology is there, it stands for 20 years.

It's not a question of outright removal of every last bit. Natural gas will remain a player in our electricity system, especially in different regions, increasingly in a backup role, but we really want to take advantage of low-cost clean options that can lower electricity bills for Canadians as much as possible.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Côté, in the microgrids that combine diesel, wind power, solar power and storage, what sources actually provide continuity of service during adverse weather conditions?

[Frédéric Côté]

Because the microgrids you're referring to are stand-alone power systems, they aren't connected to the national grid. Right now, stand-alone power systems in Canada rely mainly on diesel-generated electricity. The idea is to reduce the carbon footprint as much as possible, which means reducing the use of the diesel generator as much as possible, by making the most of available wind and sun, and by storing electricity when there's a surplus of power.

What the research shows us is that we can significantly reduce the use of diesel. Obviously, in the specific context of a stand-alone power system, you can't take advantage of interties with neighbours and the benefits of a larger geographical area.

That means diesel is still required to ensure stability and security, but the idea is to reduce the reliance on fossil fuels as much as possible and benefit from local energy sources, whether the wind or the sun.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Considering the weather reality in Quebec, which regularly leads to periods of intense energy demand, is it realistic to have a grid based mainly on renewable energy?

[Frédéric Côté]

Currently, when you look at the situation in Quebec, you see that 97% of electricity generation comes from renewable sources, that is, a mix of wind, solar and so on.

When you look at the overall energy picture in Quebec, you see that fossil fuel energy still accounts for 55% of the total consumption, which is mainly due to transportation. From that perspective, I would say that there's an opportunity to reduce greenhouse gas emissions and the use of oil imports. It's interesting because when you look at the trade balance, imports of petroleum products are still a negative factor in the trade balance.

That means electrification is a way to reduce the use of fossil fuels and increase the use of renewable energy.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Thank you, both.

Mr. Saini, welcome to the committee. You have five minutes.

[Gurbux Saini, Liberal, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses.

Being a British Columbian MP, I want to ask Mr. Pivnick a question about the northwest transmission line, which has been proposed as one of the major projects. It will be going to the area where we have a lot of critical minerals.

Could I hear your viewpoint on how, besides creating a lot of jobs, it will help what we're trying to accomplish in this process?

[Evan Pivnick]

I think we talked a lot previously about the interties between provinces, but “intra”, inside an individual province's transmission infrastructure, is just as vital. That transmission line unlocks an incredible opportunity in what's called the “golden triangle”, for those not from or living in northwest B.C. It holds significant opportunity to provide critical minerals and opens up new mines that have been on hold and looking for electricity for a long time.

As we talked about with the industrial electricity strategy, the ability to provide mines with electricity is one of the precursors to unlocking the investment in those mines. I've actually seen them standing up and being able to provide it. Transmission infrastructure is absolutely vital to seeing those investments move forward in B.C.

[Gurbux Saini, Liberal, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

The Government of Canada has announced one office, the Major Projects Office, to take care of the major infrastructure projects. Do you see that as a major step rather than having the provincial governments and several different groups trying to approve those projects?

[Evan Pivnick]

Thanks for the question.

I think it represents an opportunity to prioritize with finite resources and decisively move forward key projects. I think we would be highlighting the need for those projects to represent clean growth sectors for the economy, as we've mentioned.

From an energy exports perspective, it's the ability to make sure that what Canadians are increasingly able to bring to market is what our trading partners are looking for, especially as we seek to diversify trade beyond the United States. That's where electrification is really taking off.

[Gurbux Saini, Liberal, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

In a recent trip to India, we made some decisions on nuclear energy technology to be sold to India. Do you think that will help the world clean up the coal that has been talked about as one of the difficulties we are facing?

[Evan Pivnick]

Nuclear energy certainly represents one of the key areas where Canada has competitive advantages. We have expertise and can be exporting not just goods, but services and the ability to stand up, manage and operate these facilities. I think that's going to end up being one of the key opportunities here. As with any of the clean options, it's no silver bullet. It alone will not answer the need.

When it comes to low cost, we really should...domestically but also when we look at what the rest of the world is deploying, like renewables or battery storage. This is where countries are going to be looking to maximize because of the speed at which they can be stood up and the cost at which they can generate electricity. Looking at how we can play into those supply chains should also be a priority.

Certainly, nuclear has a role to play, especially from an energy exports perspective.

[Gurbux Saini, Liberal, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

I think that the Canada greener homes affordability program is being implemented by some provinces, but it's not something that is available across Canada. How can the federal government help so that this is made available throughout Canada and so that every province is able to take part in it?

Either one of you can answer.

[Evan Pivnick]

This goes back to the ability to ensure that Canadian households can take advantage of the cost savings from clean energy technologies. This will help drive manufacturing. This will help drive jobs in installation. This will build Canadian know-how and experience in this. This will also be a resource that can be increasingly leveraged by utilities to reduce costs elsewhere in the system.

From the federal government's perspective, it's about making sure that it is supporting electrified technologies. We should be looking at electric heat pumps as much as possible or, at a minimum, hybrid. That's going to be absolutely essential for many regions. That's going to be an opportunity.

The ability for the federal government to help ensure households can get over the upfront costs of the technologies involved so that they can take advantage of the cost savings of operating these systems is going to be absolutely vital.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Thank you, Mr. Saini.

Thank you to our witnesses. That was a lively exchange between members of Parliament. We appreciate your being with us.

As Mr. Simard mentioned, we welcome briefs. We welcome additional information, if you'd like to submit it to the clerk.

With that, colleagues, we are going to break while we prepare for our next panel.

We'll suspend for five minutes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Colleagues, please take your seats. I've allowed a little more time for bonding because we have new members.

It's good to be back. We'll resume the meeting, as we have new witnesses. I'll welcome them on your behalf, colleagues.

From the Atlantic Hydrogen Alliance, we have Derek Estabrook, executive director, by video conference. From the Edmonton Region Hydrogen Hub, we have Brent Lakeman, executive director, also by video conference.

All witnesses, as I've said before, have conducted a mandatory witness onboarding test.

Let me make a few comments for the benefit of the new witnesses.

Please wait until I recognize you by name before speaking. I remind you that all comments should be addressed through the chair. You will each have five minutes for your opening remarks, after which we will open the floor to questions.

Mr. Estabrook, we're going to start with you. You have the floor for five minutes.

[Derek Estabrook, Executive Director, Atlantic Hydrogen Alliance]

Mr. Chair and members of the committee, I am Derek Estabrook, executive director of the Atlantic Hydrogen Alliance.

Thank you for the opportunity to offer my remarks about the role that low-carbon hydrogen exports from Atlantic Canada can play in Canada's energy export strategy.

Canada is fortunate to have an abundance of what much of the world needs, which is a diverse mix of clean and conventional energy resources. In the wake of recent energy shocks, including Russia's continued aggression in Ukraine and hostilities in Iran, energy security and supply resilience have become defining priorities for our European allies. They're looking for stable, reliable and long-term energy partners, like Canada.

This is our hydrogen moment. The global energy transition is accelerating, and our allies in western Europe are building the infrastructure to support growing hydrogen demand, such as ports, ammonia crackers, hydrogen pipelines and hydrogen fuelling stations. Atlantic Canada is well positioned to meet that demand. Our ice-free deepwater ports offer direct access to European markets. Our region is geographically closer to Hamburg, Germany, than to Calgary. Atlantic Canada has abundant onshore and offshore wind resources, and while we can't ship wind across the Atlantic, we can convert it into green hydrogen and its derivatives, such as ammonia, methanol and sustainable aviation fuel, which can be shipped. Decades of experience in offshore energy, hydro power and refining has built expertise and an industrial foundation that translate directly to the emerging hydrogen sector.

The policy environment in Europe is also beginning to align. Earlier this year, the European Commission approved a double auction mechanism, administered through H2Global, to support the production and export of renewable hydrogen, including hydrogen derivatives, from Canada to Germany. This approval unlocks matching support from the Government of Canada, bringing combined funding to over $600 million. The H2Global mechanism is designed to bridge the price gap between what Canadian producers need to make their projects financially viable and what European buyers are currently prepared to pay. The program is expected to kick-start our green hydrogen export sector and support up to 300 megawatts of hydrogen electrolysis capacity in Canada.

Also, Germany's parliament recently amended its GHG reduction legislation to set binding quotas for renewable fuels, including hydrogen and its derivatives, in the transportation sector. This creates real, durable demand, and Canadian hydrogen exporters are really well placed to help close the gap between that demand and Germany's own domestic production capacity.

I also want to address what some may see as slowing momentum in the hydrogen sector. While the pace of hydrogen development has moderated recently, the direction hasn't changed. The International Energy Agency's 2025 “Global Hydrogen Review” confirms that the number of projects reaching a final investment decision grew by nearly 20% last year, installed electrolyzer capacity has increased ninefold since 2021 and global hydrogen investment has grown from under $500 million in 2021 to nearly $8 billion in 2025 and is projected to grow fivefold by 2030. This trajectory mirrors the early scaling curves of solar, wind and lithium-ion batteries, technologies that also required sustained government support before achieving commercial viability.

I think we have to remember that lesson. Green hydrogen is an immature but strategically important sector that requires targeted, sustained policy support during the critical early development years. There are several large-scale green hydrogen projects here in Atlantic Canada that are focused on exporting hydrogen and derivatives to western Europe, and they're at various stages of development across our region. The funding from the upcoming Canada-Germany hydrogen auction is an important start, but to move shovel-ready projects to final investment decision, sustained support programs are necessary.

In conclusion, the hydrogen export opportunity is real, and the conditions for success are well aligned. We have favourable geography, abundant resources and willing producers and offtakers on both sides of the Atlantic. Now we need the policy and funding support to bring them together.

Thank you.