Official Languages Committee on May 3rd, 2007

[The Chair, Conservative, Guy Lauzon]

You have two minutes remaining.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Nepean—Carleton, ON]

We have before us a panel of sports experts, and we want to build the next generation of hockey players.

Are you familiar with the policy established by our government to grant tax credits to parents allowing them to defray some of the costs of putting their children in sporting activities, since these activities are very expensive?

If so, do you support the policy? Do you believe that this policy will help parents cover some of the huge costs?

[Bob Nicholson]

Thank you very much.

On having this opportunity to speak, I can tell you that I was supposed to be in Russia with the team and having other international meetings today. I respect being here, and I also feel good that we get to lay out our case. As I've said many times here today, Shane Doan is a person who is our captain and has been doing a great job.

That you're 100% behind the team will mean a lot, because right now they're not sure. They're not supposed to play for the names on the back of their jerseys; they're supposed to play for the logo on the front of their jerseys. Through some of this, some of them are questioning why. That message will be very well received.

The tax credit for kids is huge, and I'm not talking about hockey; I'm talking about sports and recreation. That was a huge initiative by this government, and I thank all of you for that. It shows that you care about kids and that they get to participate in recreation and sports. We need that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Guy Lauzon]

We'll stop you there, unfortunately, Mr. Nicholson. Thank you very much for your comments.

Mr. Nadeau will ask the next question.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Good morning, gentlemen.

Since five minutes goes very quickly, I will get right to the point.

The year 1972 was a very important milestone in my young life; I remember watching the series of the century, those eight famous hockey games, as a teenager, and I could probably give you the play-by-play account today. I remember all the notes I made and everything to do with that momentous event.

Hockey is a sport that brings together Quebeckers and Canadians in a shared mesmerizing experience. Whether we are talking about olympic, professional or amateur hockey, huge numbers of young people played it when I was young, and that is still the case today. So it is an extremely powerful symbol. We can all agree on that.

There is another very important aspect, which is that we would like to see the Canadian team come out on top. We can agree on that as well, and that is not our issue today. We are talking here about respect, basic respect, in the context of this powerful symbol that is hockey. We see ourselves in this sport and we identify with it. When we watch hockey, it becomes as if we actually have the puck on our stick or in our glove, depending on which position we imagine ourselves playing and what is taking place.

What I find extremely hurtful is to hear you say that the National Hockey League is more important than the courts. A situation that was brought up earlier is currently before the courts. To show a minimum of respect for human rights in Quebec and Canada—and in this case, in view of the allegations that were made—Team Canada and its executives, the coaches and so on should have shown some sensitivity so as not to pour oil on the fire.

This player wears a "C" on his jersey. Phil Esposito in 1972 was a role model. Over the years, there have been other elite players that people have identified with. Even though I am a Quebecker, I was very proud. But now something has broken because there has not been a decision. The National Hockey League is not a god. Do you remember Bobby Hull and where he was in 1972? Mr. Trudeau got down on his knees and begged the NHL authorities, but they refused to let Bobby Hull be on the team. Imagine what that team would have been like if he had been there.

In the context of the respect that has to come into this debate, there is the issue of conduct and ethics. This is a sport. We teach our boys and girls to be respectful of other people in this sport and every other sport. What message do our children get when they know that this captain is caught up in this kind of situation? It seems that you really don't get it. There is something missing. It is not for nothing that the problem has ended up here in the committee.

When Colin Campbell comes here and tells us, as politicians, to go back to our corner, to go back to our penalty box and let the players play, the fact is that there is something at stake. There is a basic issue here that seems to me to be beyond you. There is a lack of respect towards the courts that are dealing with this case. We are not saying that Mr. Doan should pack his bags and go home. We are saying that the symbol that has been conferred on him is much greater than what he deserves, given the current situation.

Now what do you do if players are accused of racial discrimination in the context of their sport?

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Guy Lauzon]

Unfortunately, Mr. Marcil or

Mr. Nicholson, you only have about 30 seconds to respond.

[Bob Nicholson]

I've talked about respect today, and it is something we want. We want everyone to respect all the players, including Shane Doan.

Shane Doan has played in 46 international matches, and all the other 22 players on this team have only played a total of 116. If he wasn't named captain there would be a huge question in the minds of those other 22 players as they skated onto the ice. Talk to the other 22 players and there's only one person who should be captain of this team, because he represents our country, Canada.

[The Chair, Conservative, Guy Lauzon]

Thank you very much, Mr. Nicholson.

Mr. Godin, you may ask the next question.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I do not agree that members of Parliament should be in the penalty box. We are not playing hockey; we are here to represent our country, and we will do it the best we can. You want the National Hockey League to represent our country, and we must respect your wishes. However, no one will send me to the penalty box.

If the Conservatives think that way, there should be an election, and they would be the ones who would be in the penalty box. When the members from the governing party say that they respect official languages, we really have to wonder. They have just appointed a Canadian ombudsman who does not speak French and will be dealing with victims of crime. Then they say that they support our official languages. I am sorry, but why is there a Standing Committee on Official Languages? Why is there a Commissioner of Official Languages? It is because there are problems with official languages in Canada. That is the answer.

I think that this is the question, and it is what I am trying to tell you. He is a good player, but did the NHL put pressure on Hockey Canada to have him lose his captaincy? Do you think that this was the right decision to make, knowing that there was controversy?

In closing, the Conservatives claim that they support our team over there, when in fact all Canadians support our teams. It is the same thing as when they say that if people do not support our soldiers in Afghanistan, it means that they are against them. That is small-minded talk, and we do not want to go there. We support our team, and that has nothing to do with the issue here. If there are questions that need to be asked, we will assume our responsibilities and do it.

[The Chair, Conservative, Guy Lauzon]

Mr. Nicholson, would you like to reply?

[Bob Nicholson]

Thank you for supporting Team Canada.

There was no pressure from the National Hockey League to name Shane Doan to Team Canada or name him captain. That's the responsibility of Team Canada. We went through the same process with naming this captain as we have through our women's world championships, our men's world championships, our world juniors. It's something we talk a lot about, and I can tell you that we respect both the French and English languages. We want to make sure that as we educate all of our young boys and girls, we do it in both languages. I truly mean that, and I'll do everything in my power to make that happen in hockey in this country.

I also feel very strongly that we should all support Shane Doan as our captain of Team Canada. I can't say it enough. I know him as an individual. I know what he means to the other 22 players. I just hope that sometime along the way, you'll get to meet Shane Doan. I truly do, because he is a special Canadian who puts on the Canadian jersey for all of us. I think the courts will show in the future what's going to happen, and I hope Shane Doan will be talked about again by this government after the court proceedings.

[The Chair, Conservative, Guy Lauzon]

You have one minute left.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

You said that Mr. Doan did not say these things, that it may have been someone else. If he has evidence that it was someone else who said these things, why does he not name that person? That would exonerate him, I think.

If I was the one who had said something, I would not like to see you accused of it. I would be honest enough to come forward. So if it was someone else, since we are talking about a conversation between two people, why is that person hiding? Have you asked the NHL people that question? You are smiling a little bit. Did you ask that question?

[Bob Nicholson]

I can't speak for every individual who plays the game of hockey. You always try to teach your kids as they're growing up to be upfront and take on responsibility. We'll see through the court process if someone does and who that is. I certainly hope the person who did say those words will stand up at that time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Guy Lauzon]

Thank you very much, Mr. Nicholson.

I believe we have time for another quick round of five minutes each. We'll just get right into it, and I'll ask Mr. Murphy to start that third round.

[Brian Murphy, Liberal, Moncton—Riverview—Dieppe, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

To begin with, I would like to say that we fully support our national hockey team, we hope that you will win the gold medal. We also have a great deal of respect for the members of Parliament who are asking questions. Once again, I would like to thank you for appearing here today, since you have shown a great deal of respect for the process.

I come from Acadia. I am an anglophone who has learned French, unfortunately, while playing hockey in the Moncton region. Our community of Moncton, New Brunswick, is bilingual. Perhaps it is too bad that the whole country is not like Moncton, since we live together and we are sensitive to questions of bilingualism.

Having said that, the great Acadian hockey stars that I know of—Gordie Dwyer, Oscar Gaudet, and Charlie Bourgeois—certainly didn't need a committee of Parliament to protect their rights on the ice. But it's good that structure has been put in place for tolerance.

I'm leading to a question in this regard to you, Mr. Nicholson, about tolerance on the ice at all levels.

When I think of Parliament, I don't think it's our role to choose the team. The best thing that's happened today is that members of the government have said they don't want a role in choosing the team. I fear that if they did, they'd all be Conservatives first and lousy hockey players second, so I'm glad we got that admission.

But seriously, you have suggested that there are programs in place to show greater sensibilization and greater respect on the ice. I think every community is grappling with the tendency towards emotion, which I think this whole spectacle is about, frankly. The facts will be borne out in another place at another time, but this is very emotional; you can see that. We have to have respect for the emotion that this brings, the division.

It's coincidental that I just came from the national prayer breakfast. Perhaps we all should have said a prayer for the healing of this rupture in our support for the national game.

Having said that, assure us, please, again and in more detail, how respect for girls and for female amateur hockey, respect for the authorities, the referees and linesmen, respect for racist comments that might be made or racist attitudes, and finally—what's germane to this issue—for linguistic harmony is being taken seriously by your group and how it trickles down to our community, Canada.

[Bob Nicholson]

Thank you very much.

First of all, everyone here from Hockey Canada respects this government and respects this process. We want to bring this country together as one, and hockey does that in so many cases. As I said, Brian, we are very proud of what we've done to ensure that the atmosphere is a positive atmosphere in small-town Canada. It is something that is a very difficult task, with our hundreds and hundreds of thousands of players, coaches, and parents.

We have spent a lot of time in our parent program. We've had some great role models there with Mike Bossy, Cassie Campbell, Bobby Orr going coast to coast with Hockey Canada on these programs that touch parents, young players, and coaches.

We have a PSA program that really got to the heart of an issue in our game, and that's abusive parents. They're a small part—it's 2% of the parents—but that 2% can disrupt the atmosphere in the rink. We're going to probably continue to work on this for many years, but we're going to stay on it because it's important. The one negative situation for a young boy or girl in the game can remove him or her from the game we want them to stay in.

We have a program for all officials. We certify 40,000 officials a year coast to coast in our officiating program. With it we have an abuse program that they all get. We have it within our coaching program. We have it within our parenting program. We have hundreds of thousands of people we try to deliver it through. We're working on it and will continue to work on it in both languages.

[The Chair, Conservative, Guy Lauzon]

Thank you very much, Mr. Nicholson. I finally didn't interrupt you in mid-sentence, so maybe our timing is getting a little better.

Mr. Malo will have the next question.

[Luc Malo, Bloc, Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC]

My question is for Sport Canada. In the Canadian Strategy for Ethical Conduct in Sport, it says that one of the priorities is to promote ethical conduct in amateur and professional sport. As you know, language-related issues often come up in the context of various sports. I asked Mr. Nicholson earlier about one of the aspects of that policy statement, but I would like to hear what you have to say about it.

The strategy states: “[...]sport officials are respected for their decisions by athletes, [...] and are not interfered with in the execution of their duties.”

Did you really believe that when you wrote it, or was it simply something interesting to say that would be more in line with an ethical position?

[Jacques Paquette]

I would answer that in a number of ways. First of all, if you are referring to the NHL, it is clear that we have absolutely nothing to do with them.

[Luc Malo, Bloc, Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC]

It says that one of the priorities is to promote ethical conduct in professional sport.

[Jacques Paquette]

The policy that we have developed is mainly centred on athletes, and it basically aims to provide athletes with a safe environment so that they can fully develop their potential. We have defined standards, among other things, in our contribution agreements. We want to make sure, if there are any deficiencies with respect to the promotion of official languages, for example, that we have specific expectations. If there are problems, we expect—and this is a condition set out in the contribution agreements—that sports organizations will have developed codes of conduct and, in particular, mechanisms that give athletes, coaches and others access if a problem arises.

[Luc Malo, Bloc, Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC]

That seems like wishful thinking.

[Jacques Paquette]

No, I am sorry, but this is real. Take, for example, the promotion of official languages. In our view, Hockey Canada meets the requirements with respect to official languages and has exemplary practices in this area. There are dispute resolution mechanisms and mechanisms that enable athletes, in particular, to seek recourse when they have difficulties or find themselves in problem situations.

[Luc Malo, Bloc, Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC]

Mr. Nicholson, you told us a little earlier that if we knew Shane Doan, we would see that he was a wonderful young man with fine values. Unfortunately, that has not been proven, even though you say it is so. For that reason, some people still think that Mr. Doan should not be the team captain because the captain is the leader, the rallier, the motivator, besides the athletic abilities that he or she may have. Until he has done that, I feel that he does not deserve the privilege and honour of being the team captain. You seem to forget that and you have put him in a very uncomfortable situation. He is living through something quite difficult and has to lean on his family and his teammates. Unfortunately, you did not understand that when you appointed him captain.