Official Languages Committee on June 5th, 2007

[Guy Matte]

I will respond to the first part of your comment about your concern regarding our participation on the committee. We respond to all requests that we receive. Whether the invitation comes from a Richelieu Club, the Association des juristes du Manitoba or the press, when we are asked for facts about the Court Challenges Program, we have no hesitation, since it is part of our mandate to clarify the rationale for the Court Challenges Program and its purpose. So I am sorry that you are disappointed. I am sure that if you had been there, we would still have presented the program. If you had personally requested us to have a meeting with you, we would also have been very pleased to meet with you and explain this issue. Whenever and wherever we are asked to explain the program, we do so because we believe that it is part of our mandate.

As for your question about the criteria, I will let the executive director give you the specifics on that.

[Noël Badiou]

I will answer very quickly. Very simply, the funding criteria or eligibility criteria are contained in the Contribution Agreement. They have remained unchanged since 1994.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

They have never been changed.

[Noël Badiou]

They have never been changed; the criteria are still the same. The program is aimed at members of groups that have historically been disadvantaged and members of minority official language groups. There has been no change in the criteria since the beginning.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

You said that there were criteria for disadvantaged people. What is taken into account in order to determine whether a given group can be funded and another one cannot? There must be something that guides the decision at some point. Surely some groups have been refused funding since 1994?

[Noël Badiou]

Yes, of course. Since 1994, our annual report simply gives the figures in detail: the number of applications received, the number funded as well as the number rejected. There have certainly been applications rejected, either because they did not fall within the mandate of the Court Challenges Program, because the case was not well enough prepared or because it could undermine or violate minority language rights or equality rights.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Who is consulted when the criteria are set? Who makes up the working group?

[Noël Badiou]

There are two groups.

[Guy Matte]

First of all, we need to keep in mind that the Contribution Agreement is signed with the federal government. So it is the government that establishes the criteria. We are responsible for implementing the Contribution Agreement after it is signed.

[Noël Badiou]

I included in your information kit an organizational chart that gives details on the two decision-making committees: the equality rights committee and the language rights committee. The two committees include experts on equality rights and language rights, respectively. The names of these experts and biographical notes on them can be found on our website. They receive the funding applications and make decisions on whether a given group meets the criteria.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

I am sorry, Mr. Badiou. You referred to a document that was distributed to one member of the committee. I simply want to check whether it was distributed to all members of the committee in both official languages. Do all members of the committee have the document that Mr. Badiou is referring to?

[Guy Matte]

Yes, it is the brick you have in front of you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Very well. Thank you.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

I still want to understand how this works.

[Noël Badiou]

The two decision-making committees apply the funding criteria contained in the Contribution Agreement signed with the Department of Canadian Heritage.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

All right. When someone wants to launch a court challenge or something, some kind of file is sent, someone studies the file and decides that it is acceptable and that another application is not, for whatever reason.

[Noël Badiou]

That is correct.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

When it is not accepted, for whatever reason, it is because it is not properly prepared or because it may constitute a rights violation. Is that right? Have I understood correctly?

[Noël Badiou]

And the details are laid out in the letter of decision.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

So the letter of decision is always very detailed. And there have been no changes since 1994?

[Noël Badiou]

I have been working with the program only since 2001, but I can tell you that the Contribution Agreement has not changed since 1994.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Do you think that it would be appropriate to make changes at some point, or is it fine the way it is?

[Noël Badiou]

I think the Contribution Agreement is really quite satisfactory. If you look at the most recent evaluation, done in 2003, it clearly states that the Court Challenges Program is working very well, that its purpose is to protect rights and addresses the issues of equality and language rights as set out in the Contribution Agreement, fulfilling the government's mandate.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Ms. Boucher.

We will now move to Ms. Folco. We are beginning our second round of five minutes each for the questions and the answers. So it will be a little shorter.

Ms. Folco.

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I would also like to welcome our witnesses, as they are becoming regulars here. The fact that you've been here three times is a testament to the importance of this program for Canadians in general. This will be the third time you've appeared before us, and you are now repeating for a third time what you said on your first visit. Where I used to work, we said that the more you repeat something the better the message gets through to people. That is exactly what you are doing.

I have several comments to make. First off, Ms. Boucher's question as to whether changes should be brought to the Contribution Agreement is important. I find it unfortunate that Minister Oda did not ask this question before making a unilateral decision. She should have. The question was worth asking.

I would like to ask you for some clarification, but before I ask my question, I would like to say something. Mr. Dion, who was invited to the Summit for francophones outside Quebec last weekend, did a good job of presenting the Liberal Party's position in my opinion. He stated that we not only initiated the Court Challenges Program but that we wanted to restore it. It is an important program. I believe this as Liberal Party critic, and Mr. Dion, our party leader, not only thinks it and believes it, but he has worked to that end. In fact, I will be introducing a motion to that effect during the second part of this morning's meeting.

However, each time I have asked Ms. Oda or Ms. Verner questions in the House on the Court Challenges Program, the answer has been that the program no longer exists, but that we shouldn't worry because the money will still be given to non-governmental organizations, that they still have access to this money.

I would like to hear what you have to say to that. I'm asking the question of all witnesses. Someone must be willing to answer that. Is the government right to say that although the program as such no longer exists, this money will be going to NGOs and that they will be able to continue to receive money to challenge government decisions relating to their Charter rights? If so, how? And if not, why not?

Thank you.