Official Languages Committee on April 23rd, 2009

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Welcome to the 15^th meeting of the Standing Committee on Official Languages. We are continuing our study on the federal government's support for post-secondary institutions and their efforts in promoting bilingualism in Canada. This morning's meeting is our third to last before we move to the drafting of our report following witness testimony.

It is our pleasure to welcome representatives from Canadian Parents for French.

They are represented by the president, Mr. David Brennick.

Welcome to our committee, Mr. Brennick.

The executive director, Mr. James Shea, is also with us. Welcome to our committee.

It is also our pleasure to welcome Ms. Silvia Faitelson-Weiser, Professor at the Department of Languages, Linguistics and Translation of Laval University. Welcome to the committee.

Without further ado, I would invite Mr. Brennick to make his presentation. Further to that, parliamentarians may ask him questions. You have the floor.

[David Brennick, President, National Board of Directors, Canadian Parents for French]

Good morning, and thank you for inviting Canadian Parents for French to participate in the Standing Committee on Official Languages.

I have been an active advocate for French second-language education throughout my professional career, and now as CPF's sitting president I'm honoured to stand here before this distinguished panel to give a voice to the many students hoping to commence or continue French education in their post-secondary academic careers.

CPF will provide this committee with an objective, non-partisan perspective on the realm of post-secondary French second-language education in Canada. Our research initiatives of particular relevance to this brief are surveys of over 500 undergraduates who provided retrospective information about their secondary and post-secondary FSL experiences; FSL teacher shortage and guidance counsellor surveys; and an inventory of post-secondary opportunities and supports for anglophone students to study in their second official language.

CPF currently sits on a steering committee for a joint post-secondary initiative led by the Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages and the Association of Universities and Colleges of Canada.

What is the situation, from our view? Over 70% of students in Canada are enrolled in post-secondary programs, but despite the fact that young people are more supportive of linguistic duality and bilingualism than older generations, and despite the fact that they recognize the academic and employment benefits of official-language bilingualism, secondary and post-secondary French second-language programs are characterized by low enrolment and retention.

To resolve this situation, we feel it is necessary for the Government of Canada to put in place measures to increase the proportion of students who complete high school core French and French immersion programs, to increase the number of opportunities to continue studying in French at the post-secondary level.

We advance a number of notions and suggestions for enhancing recruitment and retention in high school French second-language programs. First is to ensure equitable access to core and immersion programs--and the operative word here is equitable. The increasingly multicultural Canadian population, and in particular the growing immigrant population, provide opportunities for the government to implement strategies that capitalize on the strong support for and acceptance of multilingualism that is characteristic of this population. Currently, no federal or provincial policies explicitly ensure allophone students access to French second-language education. Such gaps in policy have led to the possible exclusion of allophone students from French second-language studies and language planning.

Federal government policies and practices should ensure that English second-language graduates are expected and encouraged to enrol in French second-language programs; ensure that multiple entry points to French second-language immersion programs are established and maintained to accommodate the FSL goals of English second-language graduates without prior French experience; and revise official-language acquisition planning to include allophone students.

Extending French immersion programming to students with a wide range of academic abilities is important. High school French immersion programming is essentially delivered primarily via advanced-level courses geared to university-bound students, despite the fact that general-level students will enter service sector jobs in greater numbers. While only 13% of Canadians hold university degrees, a full 30% hold post-secondary diplomas or certificates granted by community colleges.

Students of lesser academic ability and those requiring remedial or special education supports are often counselled out of immersion programs because few school districts provide special education support services for immersion students. This is particularly unfortunate because we know that research shows us, tells us, that these students are not further handicapped in immersion programs. They do as well in immersion as they do in the English stream, and if they choose immersion, they have the added employment advantage of bilingualism.

With this backdrop, the Government of Canada, in our view, should extend immersion programming to general-level programs and courses in secondary schools; ensure that early French immersion programming, which is unique in its suitability for the widest range of student abilities, is maintained, supported, and expanded in all jurisdictions; fund longitudinal research studies to identify the types of learning disabilities, if any, that would make students poor candidates for immersion programs; and finally, ensure that education specialist support services are available to students in French immersion.

In terms of providing factual information about the benefits of bilingualism and French second-language education, in our work and in the studies that we have commissioned, we find that students and parents often lack sufficient information to make informed decisions about French second-language education. Many assume that French immersion in elementary school is enough to master the language, while others remain convinced that high school students cannot achieve the level of French proficiency required to work or to continue French second-language studies at the post-secondary level.

The federal government should, in our view, establish national comparable standards of French proficiency outcomes for graduates from various elementary and secondary French second-language programs to assist parents and students in making informed program choices and to ensure that high school graduates are aware of their French abilities; develop and fund effective promotional materials to encourage youth in Canada to turn their support for bilingualism into action; ensure that guidance counsellors and teachers are informed of post-secondary opportunities and supports; fund promotional campaigns informing students of post-secondary opportunities and emphasizing the academic and employment benefits of bilingualism at a time when, in our view, there is a great need, as there will be in the foreseeable future; and finally, fund the research and development of an inventory describing the number and nature of bilingual job opportunities in Canada to encourage greater enrolment in elementary, secondary, and post-secondary French second-language programs and to assist students, guidance counsellors, and post-secondary institutions to locate appropriate job opportunities for students entering the workforce.

In terms of enhancing enrolment and program quality by ensuring an adequate supply of qualified French second-language teachers, we know that shortages of teachers with appropriate pedagogical, French language, and discipline or subject qualifications continue to plague French second-language programs across the country. Government and post-secondary institutions should continue current promotional efforts to recruit and retain qualified French second-language teachers in order to maintain and increase the availability of high school French second-language programs, including core French, integrated French, late French immersion, early French immersion, and any of the variants.

In terms of developing and implementing a national strategy to increase the number of post-secondary institutions offering opportunities for students to study in their second official language, we offer the comments that follow.

Canada is one of the few highly industrialized countries without a national strategy for post-secondary education. Indeed, we are currently unable to determine post-secondary enrolment rates for French immersion graduates within Canada, and reports of the testing done by the international program for international student assessment, or PISA, do not distinguish immersion student outcomes from those of English and French first-language programs.

We strongly encourage the Government of Canada to act on findings and adopt recommendations from a joint post-secondary initiative by the Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages and the Association of Universities and Colleges of Canada, in order to develop and implement a strategy to provide more post-secondary opportunities for students in Canada to study in their second official language.

Such a strategy should do the following: encourage and support the development of a coalition of post-secondary institutions tasked with coordinating pan-Canadian efforts; gather French second-language educational data at the elementary, secondary, and post-secondary levels to inform national and post-secondary language planning; establish more university courses and programs taught in French beyond French language and literature courses, courses that would provide appropriate supports for anglophone students studying in their second language; encourage and assist francophone community colleges to recruit and support students studying French as their second official language; develop and implement policies to allow anglophone community colleges to offer programs taught in French; implement lifelong French second-language learning opportunities that include second-language acquisition, maintenance, and enhancement.

Language training should be available at little or no cost.

In terms of recruiting and retaining students by enhancing the relevance and appeal of French-language courses and programs for anglophone students, we suggest the provision of a wide range of courses and programs related to students' diverse fields of study, not just language and literature options. We also suggest adopting immersion pedagogical methods and building on the research that we know is associated with French second-language teaching and learning, which are associated with higher proficiency levels than the more traditional foreign-language approach. Those of us involved in French second-language teaching and learning know that the use of the “foreign” connotes a certain approach to language teaching and learning, one that might be based on grammar and translation.

We would suggest accommodating the wide range of French-language proficiency levels presented by core and immersion graduates. We would suggest the provision of academic and social supports to anglophone students studying in their second official language, as identified by a CPF survey of over 500 undergraduates that I referenced earlier.

Examples of such supports are subject-based language tutorials and organized opportunities for students to interact with native French-speaking Canadians. We would also suggest very strongly the implementation of the common European framework of reference for languages to ensure national proficiency standards and to provide marketable second-language accreditation for post-secondary graduates seeking employment.

With respect to French second-language teacher recruitment and retention, we offer the following suggestions: develop and implement pan-Canadian standards for teacher education and teacher qualifications; encourage and assist the Council of Ministers of Education to implement pan-Canadian teacher mobility agreements, similar to the one recently developed by Alberta and British Columbia; and finally, conduct promotional campaigns to encourage high school graduates to consider French second-language teaching careers.

In conclusion, by ensuring equitable access to French second-language programs for all students in Canada; by enhancing enrolment and retention in high school French second-language programs; by reassuring parents, students, and teachers of the second-language abilities of FSL graduates; and by establishing more post-secondary opportunities for French second-language graduates to study in French, the Government of Canada, in our view, will be well placed to enhance support for linguistic duality and to meet both public service and labour force demands for bilingual staff.

Thank you for affording Canadian Parents for French the opportunity to contribute to your deliberations today.

Thank you. Merci.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Mr. Brennick.

I let you extend your time a little. You have brought us more than 25 recommendations this morning that are aimed at the core of our study, so the members will have the opportunity to ask some questions.

First of all, I would like to hear from the representative from Laval University, Ms. Weiser.

[Silvia Faitelson-Weiser, Professor, Department of Languages, Linguistics and Translation, Laval University]

Thank you very much.

As you will probably hear by my accent, neither French nor English is my mother tongue. As soon as I start speaking you will realize that my mother tongue is Spanish, but I will address you in French, since there is terminology involved. That is easier for us right now.

On behalf of the rector of our university, Mr. Denis Brière, I thank the committee for welcoming Laval University's testimony.

I was introduced as a professor in the Department of Languages, Linguistics and Translation, which is true, but have no fear, I will not be making a purely academic presentation, devoid of pragmatism. I have been sent to appear before your committee because up until a month ago I had been the Director, for eight years, of the School of Languages at Laval University.

Allow me to give you some history in terms of language teaching at Laval University. It does relate somewhat to Mr. Brennick's presentation; Mr. Brennick is correct. In fact, the School of Languages at Laval University is a partner of—

[An honourable member]

Canadian Parents for French.

[Silvia Faitelson-Weiser]

Yes.

Language training at Laval University, oddly enough, began in 1937 with French-language training for Americans. There was the Junior Year Abroad program which was quite trendy at the time. Quickly we steered away from the traditional model criticized by students today and which is no longer being used at Laval University, at least in general, and which was the strictly literature and linguistics model.

As of the 1940s the university developed a host of new and modern methods eventually leading to the use of the communicative method. Today they apply to e-learning courses, to new and not-so-new IT methods and to communications.

In the late 1980s, the university felt compelled to develop a policy on training in an era of globalization. Obviously, Laval University being a francophone university in a francophone environment, it felt it had to develop very advanced training in English, due to market requirements. In Quebec City, as you know, the second language is English. The university had to rise up to the challenge of ensuring its students were as bilingual as possible.

However, being a francophone university, Laval's challenge was to get students to learn English. So, through the Language School, it put ESL and FSL training on parallel tracks.

Contrary to what may have been said, the challenge for us is to see how we can really improve English-language skills among our student population.

At the same time, we continue to welcome students from all over the world to come and learn French. Over the last few years we have noticed some changes, mainly with respect to Canadians. Canadian students only come to Laval in the summertime, through the Explore program. It is the only government assistance we receive for bilingualism.

Moreover, with respect to Explore, we have noted this year that there has been a drop in the number of scholarships, unfortunately. Sometimes we do not manage to reach our quota. In fact in the summertime, our students, and I think this is a generalized trend in Canada, prefer to or need to work. And spending five weeks doing nothing but learning the other language or visiting another province is a problem for them.

All provinces now have Explore and there are still thousands of students travelling through this program, which must certainly improve interprovincial communications. Perhaps it would be advisable to find other ways to encourage students to practise, learn and improve their knowledge of a second language.

At the university we are developing, among other things, e-learning courses within microprograms. Now, we believe that we could probably get students to acquire three skills, certainly at a distance, such as oral comprehension, writing comprehension and writing practice.

With respect to oral practice, perhaps they could take short immersion programs. As we have seen, many students cannot travel, they cannot or they do not want to. Regardless, they are not prepared to travel, not even for the five weeks duration of the Explore program.

We are therefore looking into developing shorter training courses, either during reading weeks, or two-week courses. They could certainly help improve students' knowledge and keep it up to date.

To do this there will need to be far clearer agreements between universities on recognition of credits. We deal with some fairly traditional universities that are unwilling to recognize credits acquired by students for courses other than literature courses. That is the traditional approach much criticized by students, but there is nothing that we can do about. At times we have to improperly classify our students, otherwise the credits we award them are not recognized by other universities.

I agree with Mr. Brennick: there is probably a dearth of standards in Canada today. We all discuss bilingualism, and perhaps it is clear for everyone what is meant by bilingualism in each institution. However, I am not so sure there is a pragmatic and applicable definition of the term.

To me, pragmatic and applicable would involve obtaining a given score on a given test, for instance. I do not want to oversimplify things, but the question we ask is whether young people know what is expected of them when we refer to bilingualism. What are they expected to do? Speak, understand, and say a few words, read?

We believe that the federal government could greatly contribute to a solution by helping universities to come up with a pragmatic accessible and coordinated definition of the required degree of bilingualism, perhaps by field of expertise or for given positions. We have looked for a definition. If one does exist we have not seen it.

Universities all have goodwill and they are all convinced that what they do is of the utmost top calibre, that they do better work than all the other universities. Perhaps we all need somebody to help us conclude that our best is equivalent to that of others, and help us come to some agreement on the way to proceed. I think the government is in a position to do that.

Our university is quite pleased to address some of the issues raised and to say that we regularly offer training courses each summer for FSL teachers.

However, as I have stated, aside from the Explore Scholarships, Canadian students are no longer coming to Laval University to learn French. Over the course of the year we have three, four or perhaps five Canadian students. Are they going to France? Obviously, when there were year-long scholarships, we used to get 300, 400 or 500 students over the fall and winter sessions. There is no longer any support, so Canadian students no longer really come to Quebec City to learn French.

I think I have shared the gist of my notes with you. Obviously, we believe the government could support teacher training courses and could perhaps implement a program of short-term summer courses for students wanting to maintain their level of bilingualism.

I thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you very much, Ms. Faitelson-Weiser. It would be interesting to know whether this drop in attendance is due to a drop in interest in the French language on the part of anglophones.

Mr. Rodriguez.

[Pablo Rodriguez, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Welcome to you all and thank you for being here.

Mr. Brennick, according the Statistics Canada the proportion of young bilingual people has significantly decreased over the last ten years. To what do you attribute this drop?

[David Brennick]

I can answer in French or English, as you wish.

[Pablo Rodriguez, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

In Spanish as well, if you like...

[David Brennick]

Our young people have so many choices these days. We believe that when we focus on the cultural and social aspect of the issue and young people see that they have an opportunity to gain experience in a different context, it is enriching to them, they gain a great deal.

Also, as stated by Ms. Faitelson-Weiser, there is an interest in short-term courses. This does not only apply to older individuals needing French for work purposes, but also to young people. They are used to short-term experiences. We have one week summer camps that exist throughout the country, for instance. These courses give young people an opportunity to share their experiences and encourage others do the same.

There are so many choices in school! The people we know working in schools tell us that in public high schools, students have to choose between being in the band and math courses. These days they are treated like royalty, but they do have to choose. It does not mean they do not want to do certain things, but they do have to make a choice. If they don't experience learning a second language in high school, what will they do at the post-secondary level?

[Pablo Rodriguez, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

Are young people outside of Quebec not interested in French, or has there been a drop in interest?

[Silvia Faitelson-Weiser]

I think statistics must be interpreted. Are there fewer young people that are bilingual or are there fewer young people speaking English and French?

[Pablo Rodriguez, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

I would say speaking English and French, the two official languages.

[Silvia Faitelson-Weiser]

French is no longer the second language in North America. There is nothing we can do about that; Spanish has replaced it. What can I say?

[Pablo Rodriguez, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

[The Member speaks Spanish.]

[Silvia Faitelson-Weiser]

Young people know this. My grandchildren living in Toronto must invest in learning a second language. Well, if there is no specific motivation to learn French, they will choose, if they are realistic, to learn Spanish. And if they are forward thinking, they will choose Japanese, Chinese or Arabic. We have seen this clearly at Laval University; there is an increase in the numbers for other languages.

[Pablo Rodriguez, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

When we refer to bilingualism in our committee, we refer to official languages. Is there a link between bilingualism and access to jobs or better jobs? In Canada, is fluency in both official languages rewarded or not?

[Silvia Faitelson-Weiser]

In my opinion, it is unclear. Francophones learn English more easily, not because English is easier to learn, but because there is no other choice. It is the universal language of communications. Have anglophones understood that they need to learn French? There is no clear policy on that. What must they be able to say in French? Is it enough to say “Bonjour, comment ça va?” Is it clear one needs to be bilingual to enter the public service? If so, why is it that whenever I am outside of Quebec and I go to a federal government office, I have to apologize for my accent and speak English? They apologize for not being able to speak French.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Mr. Rodriguez.

[Pablo Rodriguez, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

You are very welcome, Mr. Blaney.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

I was going to urge you to continue in one of our two official languages. In so doing, you would be indulgent towards our interpreters and would not reveal my ignorance of this third language.

Mr. Nadeau, you have the floor, in English or in French please.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Blaney.

Welcome to our guests.

First of all, I would like to point out that there is a Franco-Ontarian fund, the Jean-Robert-Gauthier Fund, and there is in this context a yearly literary essay competition. This year, a Laval University student, Mr. Melkevik, won the prize. In his essay, published last April 21 in Le Droit, he writes something I would subscribe to. It applies to you all. He says that the state must grant special consideration to francophone minorities: francophone communities outside Quebec must be protected, encouraged and supported.

I personally come from Ontario. I was born in Hawkesbury. I worked for a long time and with great interest among French-speaking communities in a minority setting in Canada. One of the positions I held involved Franco-Saskatchewanian school management. It was a very rewarding experience. We all know that in 1931, the Conservative government in Saskatchewan abolished French-language schools. It was not until 1995 that they were allowed to reopen. In 1968, immersion schools were created in the province, but there had not yet been talk of creating schools where French was the first language of instruction.

I have the following question for Canadian Parents for French. I would like it to be perceived as a possible solution and not so much as an attack or condemnation. I'm giving you the example of Saskatchewan because of the French fact and because your activities cover the entire country. Of the 10,000 students who could be registered in French-language schools in Saskatchewan, only 1,000 are. The other 9,000 mainly go to English-language schools or immersion schools.

The problem we had at the time and which remains, was to convince people in immersion schools to redirect FL1 students, in other words those who speak French as a mother tongue, to schools where French was the primary language rather than keep them in immersion schools. We believe, and I'm going to say a bad word now, that that amounts to total assimilation, given that these young people end up serving as models for young anglophones learning French. I do not object to anglophones learning French, but that should not happen on the backs of French-Canadian or minority French-Canadian communities.

I know that you have established a partnership with the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne, and that is very good. Partnerships lead to solutions. I would like to know whether you, at Canadian Parents for French, are prepared to tell people within provincial school boards to redirect these students towards schools where French is the first language of instruction rather than to keep them in their own school boards despite the fact that one student represents $5,400 in income? Are you prepared to do that much to support the French fact?

[David Brennick]

Mr. Nadeau, I experienced that myself in Nova Scotia, where I come from. Before the Conseil scolaire acadien provincial was established, we were the ones, we whose mother tongue... I work for a school board that brought a case before the Supreme Court regarding section 23 of the Canadian Charter of rights and freedoms. I am well aware of this phenomenon.

I would like to point out that in our part of the province, each year we lose more than 700 or 800 students. But the number of students at the Centre scolaire Étoile de l'Acadie, which is the school in our region that teaches children whose mother tongue is French, continues to increase because we work in the children's mother tongue, their first language. Our goal is not to encourage families to send their children to our schools. We respect the decision made by the families, but what is really important is that people be well-informed. Material designed to teach children in their mother tongue, in their first language, is not identical to material designed to teach children a second language. There is a big difference between the two. Many of my friends were assimilated and lost their French, their maternal tongue. That is the tragic story of Acadians in our part of the country.

We must provide clear information, but all the same, the decisions are made by the family. We have always said that the information is correct, that it's good information.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Mr. Nadeau. You will be able to continue later on.

Mr. Godin.