Evidence of meeting #22 for Official Languages in the 40th Parliament, 2nd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was military.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
Mr. Chairman, as that is not part of my mandate, I didn't look at that aspect.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Steven Blaney
Thank you, Mr. Petit.
We'll complete the second round with Mr. Godin.
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
You've taught me something. Correct me if I'm wrong. When we asked you how many complaints you had received, you answered that you did not know. I can understand that because you've just arrived. You then directed the question to Mr. Egglefield, who answered that the formal complaints, if I correctly understood, are not really... I believe instead that the complaints were filed in 2006. A recruit who enters the armed forces, whether male or female, must be strong and take what is going on or else he'll be washing the floor somewhere.
In the fall of 2006, the ombudsman went to CFB Borden and outlined his challenges in a letter to the Chief of Defence Staff, General Hillier, on January 8, 2007. In that letter, Mr. Côté explained that he had met a number of groups of unilingual francophone recruits who said they were having a lot of trouble getting services in their language. He said this was an urgent problem, that there was no reason to doubt the truth of the recruits' statements, and the base chiefs themselves acknowledged that it was difficult to provide services in French. The problems raised included, in particular, instructions and orders given in English only.
Has that changed in 2009?
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
I read the letter you are referred to. After two follow-up visits conducted since that letter, there have been some improvements, mainly thanks to the creation of a website and the appointment of an official languages champion. Most of the recommendations that we made, mainly on instruction, services offered on the base and second-language courses, had not been implemented.
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
That makes me think of the Minister of Finance who has just said that, for credit cards, they're going to set that at the highest level. You won't be using them, but it will be the same interest rate.
We currently have a problem at Borden. An official languages champion has been appointed. Was he appointed by the recruits?
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
No, he was appointed by the chain of command.
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
All right. Then they established a website, but that doesn't give any instructions. You're telling me that the other recommendations haven't been implemented. So there hasn't been much improvement.
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
Our report on the February 2008 visit mentioned that those recommendations had not been put in place.
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
All right.
There are other problems, in particular the fact that it is impossible to do well on assignments for which instructions are given in English only. Once again, that falls into the same category. Apart from the website, not much has happened.
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
We aren't satisfied with the progress achieved in the past two years. That's why, when the matter was put before me, I gave priority to the main recommendations regarding training and services.
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
I believe you went further; you said that absolutely nothing had been done.
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
The first two—
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
You pointed out the lack of vehicle maintenance manuals in French and the fact that this was justified on the grounds of financial restrictions. Is that still a problem?
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
When we talk about education and training difficulties, that involves the students who aren't receiving instructions in their mother tongue and instructors who may be bilingual but have to work overtime. It also includes course material.
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
Can you guarantee that recruits who turn to you won't be subjected to reprisals?
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
In the context of our visits, we make people aware of the fact that they can freely file their complaints directly with the ombudsman, without that resulting in reprisals.
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
Do you provide them with complaint forms, advertising designed to let them know that, if they aren't satisfied, they can complain to you? If not, do people simply wake up one morning and realize that they've had more than enough of the situation and want to find someone to complain to?
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
When we were on the base at Borden, we talked about a site that we've set up that people can use to make observations, in particular.
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
You're talking about a website? Is there a big poster in the building advertising the website and stating its address? Do you encourage people to use it to file complaints?
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
That's why my subsequent visits will—
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
That's not my question, sir.
Is there a poster somewhere in the building stating that people wishing to file complaints can do so via the website, the address of which is given?
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
I haven't gone to Borden since I took up my duties, but—
NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
If there is a website, but people don't know about it, that will produce no results.
Ombudsman, Office of the Ombudsman, Department of National Defence
During our visits, we increase people's awareness. We tell them that, if they've been unfairly treated in certain situations, they can—