Official Languages Committee on Oct. 22nd, 2009

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

I agree with you, except that we mustn't wait until we're out of money; we have to plan ahead. That's the sense of my question.

[Graham Fraser]

That figure wasn't established at random. It was established following a long discussion to very clearly determine needs. In a tough financial context, there was some fear that funding freely allocated here and there might be used for other purposes. This necessarily called for very frank and intense discussion between the government and the organizers of the Vancouver Olympic Games.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

So that should resolve the situation.

[Graham Graham]

As we speak, I have no indication that any errors were made in the calculation, but today isn't an important date for those discussions. We'll continue to monitor the file, then we'll see the results.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

So we can rely on you to follow this up.

You talked about a spirit of cooperation with the municipal level. The budgets allocated to the cities have already been stopped for the year-end. Consequently, the municipalities won't be receiving any additional funding before the Olympic Games. It's all well and good to talk about a spirt of cooperation, but there have to be incentives to achieve results.

Could there be any financial incentives for the municipalities?

[Graham Fraser]

I don't know. We don't yet have any details on the funding for signage at the municipal level.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

We're crossing our fingers and we hope they'll take part.

[Graham Fraser]

The envelope set aside for signage is not used just for signage at the Richmond Oval, I assume. However, I don't have any more details on the allocation of that envelope.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

I had the same experience as Mr. Nadeau. This summer, I went to Vancouver. At the airport, there was no problem, but when I sat down, I heard passengers on a flight from Vancouver to Montreal put a question to the Air Canada agent, who answered: “I don't speak French.”

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

We can recommend that its representatives read the official commissioner's book. We know they'll be appearing next week.

We'll continue with Ms. Glover.

[Shelly Glover, Conservative, Saint Boniface, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Welcome, once again, to the three witnesses. I liked it when you said that what is important are the results. So let's talk about the results.

We had a meeting on Tuesday with the Canada Border Services Agency. I was completely bowled over by the comments of certain opposition members about your work, its quality and your results, as well as the allegations made about the government and the relations we've had with you and with your office.

I would like you to give me your comments briefly so as to clarify and respond to those allegations. I'll start with some quotations so that you know what allegations have been made.

Here's the comment made by Mr. D'Amours, of the Liberal Party:

This morning, I'm probably going to attack the only complaint that you say you've received. Then we'll be able to see whether it's the only one that emerges in future. This is a citizen from my riding who, among other things, had problems at the Rigaud training centre. I'd like to address these questions and see how you react to them. The Commissioner may have done some work, and I say “some work” because the people were not the same from the start to the end and we'll see in future how that's handled.

The next comment was by Mr. Godin, from the NDP: “The Commissioner said that the complaint was unfounded. That's not the first time I've heard that.”

Then Mr. D'Amours said: “I believe the Commissioner of Official Languages checked to see whether there had been an active offer. However, [...]”

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chairman.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Pardon me, Ms. Glover.

Ms. Guay, you have a point of order.

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Mr. Chairman, this is irregular. We're questioning the Commissioner of Official Languages. We aren't here to cite whatever colleagues have said. This is a waste of time. We have to stick to the subject, and I believe that's not the case at present. We're talking about the Vancouver Games, not about quotations from our colleagues.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Ms. Guay, committee members are entitled to quote from public statements, and the subject is precisely services at airports. Your point of order is dismissed.

[Graham Fraser]

Mr. Chairman, if I can save some time, I can talk a little about what we've done about that complaint.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

One moment, Mr. Fraser; we're going to finish with Ms. Guay's point of order.

Thank you, Ms. Guay.

I'll now hand back to Ms. Glover.

[Shelly Glover, Conservative, Saint Boniface, MB]

I'll go back to the quotation of Mr. D'Amours, of the Liberal Party: “However, the rest as to how things went in Rigaud, on training, and before that on pre-training in Fredericton, that wasn't evaluated.” But Pierre Paquet told us that the investigation by the commissioner's Office was nevertheless quite exhaustive and added, in speaking to Mr. D'Amours: “I would say we spent perhaps 10 hours in interviews answering the investigator's questions, questions that you've raised.”

Lastly, I come to the quotation from Mr. Yvon Godin: “Mr. Chairman, it's starting to trouble me that the official government is beginning to give credit to the Commissioner of Official Languages. The official languages watchdog—I'm not saying the commissioner isn't doing a good job—but it looks like all the reports are good and nice and everyone arrives at the airport and they're even able to be served in their language. The other one goes away and takes his time to go and offer congratulations for the work done... in any case. People can judge any way they want, but when you start talking that way, I think...”

I now come to my question, commissioner. You determined that this complaint was unfounded. I found those comments unjustifiable and I would like to afford you the opportunity to say whether Mr. Paquet was right. I would like to add that I have always had great respect for your work. I've said so on numerous occasions, and I thank you. I have much more respect for your work than the opposition shows us, and I continue to say so. I think your partnership with us is essential and well appreciated.

I would like to have your comments on those quotations. I would also like to know how your relations are with the government.

[Graham Fraser]

Mr. Chairman, do I have any time left to answer?

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

You have about two minutes left.

[Graham Fraser]

With regard to this case, we conducted a fairly detailed investigation into what happened with the complainant's request. It was quite complicated. Following the investigation, we found no evidence that the agency had not used the language chosen by the complainant. Ms. Charlebois can explain that to you in greater detail.

We suspended the investigation, but we did not determine whether the complaint was founded or not. We can't say that it was unfounded, but we suspended the investigation. However, in the course of that investigation, we had discussions with agency representatives, and we realized that there was a lack of information transmitted by the central agency to people in the regions. We informed the agency that employees in the regions should be able to provide people with better information on course schedules.

As a result of that investigation, the agency now informs candidates of the language choices possible at each stage of the candidate selection and training process. The agency also emphasizes the possibility of failure if a candidate chooses training in the second language. As we've seen in other institutions as well, when, for one reason or another, a citizen chooses the second language, that person subsequently discovers, in some instances, that he or she should perhaps not have chosen the second language.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Perfect.

[Graham Fraser]

That was done without really knowing the implications of that choice. The agency therefore changed its behaviour. That's one example of an intervention that had the result of changing the institution's behaviour.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you very much, commissioner.

Thank you, Ms. Glover.

We'll now go to Mr. Nadeau.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Fraser, I asked a series of questions during my first turn. I just want to remind you of the subjects, and you can then go ahead.

In your report, you say that, at first, VANOC had five or six translator-revisors and that it would be necessary to have 65 to 70 to ensure that signage or information—brochures or written information—could be actually made available. Where do things stand in that regard? That's one of the questions.

The other situation that I find quite peculiar—you noted it in your report—is the entire matter of obtaining information simultaneously in both languages. Earlier it was said that, for certain types of information, it would take 12 hours to obtain the French version. If it's a little more urgent, every effort will be made to get it six hours later. We agree that, in a communications society, such as the one in which we live, waiting six to 12 hours for information in one of the country's two official languages is extremely disturbing.

So there's the question of translation and simultaneous information. The translation question is one thing that, among other things, troubles the federation which would like services to be ready on time because we're talking about several thousands of words that have to be translated.

I'm listening.