Official Languages Committee on March 24th, 2011

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

That is what I was waiting to see him about.

[Bill James, Director General, Human Resources Branch, Department of Industry]

Yes. I'll say two things. We have a verification program to ensure that bilingualism is one of the skills required in the hiring process, and we have received a good rating.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

I understand that you have a verification mechanism.

[Bill James]

Yes.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

Wouldn't that be an important requirement for a position?

[Bill James]

It depends on the position perhaps and the location, but I will say that we have—

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

I didn't look at all of the job offers. There are a lot. Are you saying that bilingualism is required for some positions?

[Bill James]

That is indeed the case.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

I looked several times, and I did not find it.

[Mitch Davies, Associate Assistant Deputy Minister and Champion of Official Languages, Science and Innovation Sector, Department of Industry]

It is more of a condition of employment. It is like a security clearance: you must have it to be hired. As regards competencies, we conduct interviews and tests on the quality and content of the work. For all bilingual positions, candidates must have the required level of bilingualism before being hired and receiving a job offer.

[Richard Dicerni]

I will look into it.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Mauril Bélanger]

Will you share your findings with the committee?

[Richard Dicerni]

If a position is bilingual, the candidate must clearly be bilingual.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Mauril Bélanger]

Thank you.

Thank you very much, Ms. Zarac.

Mr. Nadeau, you have the floor.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Good morning, gentlemen.

You know, Mr. Dicerni, I have often been told that a bilingual position is certainly filled by a bilingual person. In other departments, that is not the case. I won't accuse you of being like the others. If you tell me that they all are, all the better.

[Richard Dicerni]

It is 97%.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Oh, I see.

[Richard Dicerni]

That means that of the 2,400... In fact, 3,400 employees are in bilingual positions. Unless I'm mistaken, the vast majority of them meet the criteria. There are perhaps about 100 on language training. Those are the statistics I was given when I looked into the matter.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

I know, and that is basically the rule. All the same, I believe that, when a position is bilingual, the person filling it should already be bilingual. However, you do not write the rules, someone else does. I am aware of that.

Now, part V of the act deals with the language of work. That is something that bothers me considerably, and that I find frustrating. The problem lies not only in your department, but in others as well.

The D rating that you received is completely unacceptable. It is also unacceptable because, according to the statistics, 41% of Industry Canada employees whose first language is French do not feel comfortable using French in their written communications. As for the language used in communicating with their supervisors, 36% of francophones, or those who claim French as their first language of communication, feel uncomfortable communicating in their own language, i.e., French.

If I were to experience a similar situation in a federal department, I would probably not last very long. I would immediately be sent off to some dustbin or departmental dungeon because I would speak out vociferously.

Please tell me how you encourage employees to submit their reports, documents or e-mails in French? What do you say to encourage your employees?

And how do you deal with a manager who says things like "in English please" or "Why not in English?", because having things translated takes too long? Personally, I would rap that manager on the knuckles.

Those are things that I hear. I am not just being rhetorical.

What are you doing to encourage employees to write in their own language and to discourage those types of reactions from the people receiving their communications?

[Richard Dicerni]

I came to Ottawa in 1969. At the time, the example you mentioned occurred quite frequently. There were always blockages at one level of management or another. As you indicated, a French-language memo did not make it all the way to the top.

I have not spent my entire career in Ottawa, but when I returned five years ago I did notice a marked change in the city as well as within the Department of Industry. In the past, Industry Canada was considered to be one of the anglophone departments, along with the Departments of Finance and Human Resources and Skills Development.

You gave the example of someone who, because he does not understand French, would prevent any communication in that language and require employees to draft their memos in English. I do not see that happening at the Department of Industry. If you had information in that regard, I would appreciate it if you called me and let me know about a specific case.

Today we use a proactive approach to create an environment in which people can work in both official languages. Let me give you a few examples.

Discussions within my management committee are carried out one-third of the time in French and two-thirds in English. However, one meeting a month is held completely in French. That means that the people who are coming to give presentations or who want to attend expect that the proceedings of the management committee will be held in French once a month.

The department has leadership awards in areas like the management of financial resources or best practices. We decided to establish a leadership award for the promotion of official languages. The award will be presented to managers who take initiatives to encourage their use.

We also put up posters. We are encouraging people. We have networks that promote the use of both official languages. I know that management committees in some sectors alternate between French one week and English the next.

We have a whole series of specific measures. I do not think that there is a magic solution to get everyone to feel completely at ease overnight. That said, I believe that the overall trend is positive.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Part IV of the act deals with communications with and services to the public. You obtained a "D" in that regard.

What does that mean? Does it mean that people, retailers or corporations wanting to do business with the Department of Industry in French come up against a wall? Are they only being answered in English?

In the same vein, Canadian Heritage recently responded to a request by Impératif français in a letter that was solely in English. Work needs to be done. If things are so bad at Canadian Heritage, you can imagine the situation at Industry Canada, especially in a business environment that is under the American, anglophone influence.

With regard to services to the public, what barriers are still preventing you from satisfying those who want to be served in French?

[Richard Dicerni]

I have three or four comments I would like to make. One of the things I am monitoring—

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Mauril Bélanger]

I would ask you to be brief, Mr. Dicerni, or you could come back to those thoughts later, because there are only five seconds left in the current round of questions.

[Richard Dicerni]

I will come back to them later. I am sure that someone else will ask me the same questions regarding services to the public. That way we can accomplish two things at once.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Mauril Bélanger]

Thank you, Messrs. Dicerni and Nadeau.

Mr. Godin, you have the floor.