Official Languages Committee on Oct. 18th, 2011

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

I examined the issue and I decided that this should be done internally to save money.

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

So this was a matter of costs?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

It was to reduce the costs of the exercise. By doing this internally, I managed to have information collected in a manner that was less costly.

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

Can you tell me how much this exercise did cost?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

In fact, it cost the time it took our employees to do this work in-house, and that is all.

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

Can this be quantified?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

Yes, I can quantify it for you. I have a general idea of the resources I had available to do this. I would not like to just give you a figure off the top of my head today, but I can provide it to you. That is not a problem.

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

With regard to the mid-term evaluation, will the minister be making the decision to release it?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

Yes.

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

I have a question for Mr. Gourde, Mr. Chairman.

Could Mr. Gourde inquire from his department whether the department or the minister, and the government, intend to make this midstream evaluation public?

I am not expecting an immediate answer but I am putting the question to Mr. Gourde.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Mr. Bélanger.

Mr. Lauzon, you have the floor.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I want to welcome our guests. I have a few questions to ask.

First, you say on page 15 that the government has invested $1.1 billion, and you suggest that there were other investments from other departments. Do you have a figure, an estimate?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

I don't have a total figure for the investments by federal bodies because they are too diffuse throughout the system. They are here, there and everywhere. Tracking down all of these amounts would really be prohibitive.

We know that Heritage Canada, for instance, has funds available for official language purposes that are not included in the roadmap.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Are we talking about large amounts?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

At Heritage Canada, yes, quite large.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Are we talking about the same amount? One billion dollars?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

In fact, Heritage Canada is a subset. So we are not talking about a billion dollars at Heritage Canada. We estimate that if there are about a hundred million dollars on a yearly basis going to Heritage Canada under the roadmap, there would be more than twice that not included in the roadmap.

I'd like to specify that Heritage Canada is in a particular situation, but there are other departments that promote official languages that are not included in the roadmap. I am thinking for instance of Transport Canada, which recently put in place a plan in connection with part 7. Transport Canada is responsible for all transport facilities in Canada and for things such as bilingual signage, through airport authorities and so on.

Consider also Fisheries and Oceans and Agriculture Canada, departments that are active in rural communities. I'm thinking also of fishermen on Quebec's Lower North Shore, where there is an English-speaking community, to mention only that.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

The investment may be even larger than is indicated.

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

Yes, but quantifying it in a precise way is a difficult exercise.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

My next question has to do with the decline in the proportion of people whose first language is French, which figure has been dropping over the past 45 years. Is mother tongue a good indicator?

Personally, my mother tongue was French. But I went to English schools and I learned French once I became an adult. In my region, in Cornwall, a third of the population has French as a mother tongue and yet perhaps only 20% of them speak French. That's somewhat bizarre.

Can you explain why we are continuing to...

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

This is a Statistics Canada process. The question is interesting and that is why we also asked them that. According to what the Statistics Canada experts explained to us, in their statistical survey, they consider that mother tongue is a significant indicator of the minority language population, in this case.

They carried out their statistical survey to attempt to verify correlations and so on. That is why the figures exist. Basically, Statistics Canada experts compile these data because they do calculations pursuant to their own statistical verifications, and these are significant numbers that mean something.

All of that said, one has to see their meaning when attempting to explain them. That is why I was taking the time to specify that there are different terms and different definitions. Depending on the debate one is having, some figures are more relevant than others.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Fine. I had a question concerning the level of bilingualism among francophones and allophones.

The bilingualism rate is 12.1% for Canada as a whole.

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

In 2006, the rate of bilingualism was at 17% in Canada. That is the first point at the top of page 5.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Fine.

Excuse me. I was talking about the English-French rate of bilingualism among allophones.

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

Among allophones. These are basically people whose first language is neither English nor French. Their rate of bilingualism was 12%.