Official Languages Committee on March 24th, 2015

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Welcome to the 42nd session of the Standing Committee on Official Languages. Today is Tuesday, March 24, 2015.

We are here pursuant to Standing Order 108 to study the Government of Canada's programs designed to promote francophone immigration into Canada's official-language minority communities.

Four groups are joining us today. We will start with Ms. Hébert, from the Conseil économique du Nouveau-Brunswick.

The floor is yours, Madam.

[Anne Hébert, Director General, Conseil économique du Nouveau-Brunswick]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Seven minutes is not a great amount of time, so I am going to talk very quickly. My apologies for that in advance.

My name is Anne Hébert. I am the Director General of the Conseil économique du Nouveau-Brunswick, an organization founded in 1979 to be the voice of the province's francophone business community. We represent almost 1,000 companies of all sizes, from all sectors, and from all regions of the province. We also have the mandate to manage the RDEE New Brunswick.

Let me give you a little background.

For us, access to qualified labour has been the greatest concern for francophone entrepreneurs for more than 10 years. Our population is also decreasing, especially in rural areas, where most francophones are located.

When francophone companies find access to qualified labour difficult, they become less productive and less competitive. There is a danger that we will have fewer francophone entrepreneurs and fewer opportunities for the next generation of entrepreneurs. This means that we are going to lose a large number of francophone businesses.

The demographic challenges are greater in rural areas where our primary and secondary sectors are located. Forestry, agriculture, fishing and transportation are already experiencing major labour problems.

New Brunswick's francophone population represents about 33% of the total population of the province. Between 2006 and 2011, only 12% of newcomers had French as their official language. If the birth rate does not go up and if our population growth comes from immigration only, we are going to lose ground quickly. Even if we succeeded in increasing the birth rate to maintain our demographic weight, we would lose all the economic and social advantages stemming from the diversity that immigration provides.

Francophone immigration is more difficult and needs more effort than anglophone immigration. In a province in which it is difficult to live in French only, it is doubly difficult. We have French-language immigrants who choose anglophone communities to live in and who send their children to anglophone schools because they see how necessary it is to speak English. In terms of immigration, therefore, we do not start on an equal footing with anglophone communities. Our position is that special steps must be taken to facilitate, encourage and stimulate francophone immigration.

The Francophone Significant Benefit program was an example. Unfortunately, it no longer exists. The new program, Express Entry, focuses on businesses and their needs, and that is good. But we do not know the importance that will be attributed to language inside the program.

Businessmen have positions to fill. When they are looking for workers, they are not concerned with the relative weight of their linguistic communities. They are looking for the skills they need. How are we to convince companies and employers to recruit francophones? They have to be given the tools.

Those tools can take several forms. For example, incentives could be offered for companies that recruit francophones. Our organization's expertise is not in immigration. Do not ask us to dissect programs and analyze how they work. But we know business very well. If their costs are reduced, if processes are streamlined, if steps are eliminated, if the road to francophone immigration is made easier, that is the road businessmen will take.

Having francophone immigrants come to our country can be streamlined in the same way, by reducing costs, streamlining the process and eliminating steps. The bigger the pool of potential francophone immigrants, the more likely businesspeople are to have access to francophone immigrants.

Another way of doing so would be to provide support to businesses in the sectors where we know the need is most urgent, with a view to encouraging them to choose francophone immigrants with the skills they are looking for.

We must increase awareness among the immigrants that want to come our way. We must explain to them the reality of the linguistic duality, the climate, the bilingual labour market, the opportunities for employment and entrepreneurship. We must also make them aware of their right to services in French, because otherwise they will look for those services in English, increasing the likelihood that they will become part of anglophone linguistic communities.

The system as it currently operates does not encourage regional organizations to direct francophone immigrants towards French-language services, because their survival depends on the number of cases they handle. So they do not want to refer those clients elsewhere, with the result that potential francophone immigrants are steered towards English-language communities.

In conclusion, minority francophone communities are facing major challenges in immigration, but they also have major needs for immigration. This must be recognized and measures must be put in place to mitigate these additional challenges that majority language communities do not face.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Ms. Hébert.

We now move to Mr. Corbineau from the Fédération des francophones de Terre-Neuve et du Labrador.

[Gaël Corbineau, Director General, Fédération des francophones de Terre-Neuve et du Labrador]

Thank you.

Mr. Chair, ladies and gentlemen, my name is Gaël Corbineau and I am the director general of the Fédération des francophones de Terre-Neuve et du Labrador.

The Fédération des francophones de Terre-Neuve et du Labrador was established in 1977 and is a not-for-profit organization working to preserve and promote the rights and interests of our communities. Since 2007, the FFTNL has been working in support of francophone immigration in its communities. In 2010, it created an internal initiative to promote francophone immigration. The purpose of this initiative is to showcase our province as a destination for immigrants from francophone countries and to encourage employers to hire bilingual employees from abroad when they cannot find employees in Canada. Our mission is to bring candidates and potential employers together.

In January 2011, thanks to provincial and federal funding, the FFTNL established the Réseau d'immigration francophone de Terre-Neuve-et-Labrador. This network has a year-round, full-time coordinator. Its goal is to make life easier for new arrivals. The objectives of the network are as follows: to increase the number of francophone immigrants to Newfoundland and Labrador; to maximize the potential offered by permanent residence programs; and to improve newcomers’ ability to integrate into the province’s francophone communities.

To achieve these objectives, our network established an advisory board made up of key representatives from the francophone community and the field of immigration. The board monitors the development of francophone immigration in Newfoundland and Labrador. Its members are: the Association communautaire francophone de Saint-Jean, in the provincial capital, the Association francophone du Labrador, the Association régionale de la côte Ouest, our provincial RDEE, the Association for New Canadians, or ANC, the Refugee and Immigrant Advisory Council, Memorial University of Newfoundland, and the provincial government's Office of Immigration and Multiculturalism.

Newfoundland and Labrador has made great progress in recent years in raising awareness of and promoting francophone immigration. The RIF is very active in the francophone community and among immigration agencies, such as the Partenariat local en immigration de Saint-Jean, and the province’s coordinating committee on newcomer integration. We also have a presence in the province’s business community.

Despite this success, francophone newcomers to our province are at a disadvantage compared with the majority population. They do not have any direct services in French. Among the services unavailable to them are: settlement services, pre-arrival services, integration services, immigrant and family support and counselling services, refugee services, international student services, and educational support services for students.

The FFTNL believes that the federal government's francophone immigration plan will be successful only if communities have the right tools as well as an adaptable mandate and flexible funding. We are encouraged by initiatives such as the outreach tours to Canadian embassies in Paris, Tunis, Rabat and Dakar, and by the introduction of the employer liaison network. We are anxiously awaiting the introduction of one or more measures to include a “francophone lens” in the express entry system, which is the new system for managing applications for permanent residence.

Minister Alexander's statements clearly support francophone immigration, but we are now waiting for him to take action. However, the federation is concerned by certain federal decisions that are detrimental to francophone immigration. For example, cancelling funding for francophone communities to participate in the Destination Canada employment fair, and abruptly ending the Francophone Significant Benefit program last September.

It should be noted that we cannot meet this government’s goal for increasing francophone immigration unless we have targeted assistance, because our communities are at a definite disadvantage when competing for immigrants. As I said earlier, official language minority communities must have the proper tools to be successful and to meet the outcomes established by the federal government.

Another challenge is the identification of French-speaking immigrants according to their first official language spoken. We often lack data on newcomers whose mother tongue is neither English nor French but who speak French fluently. As a result, these clients are not systematically referred to francophone communities since they were not identified as francophones at their point of entry into Canada.

Too often, we meet immigrants who have been here for months or even years but do not know that there is a francophone community here to support them. This is a particularly cruel blow for these newcomers as the lack of support often makes their integration longer and more difficult. They and their families run the risk of being completely assimilated by the linguistic majority.

But it is also a significant blow to our communities because they lose members, to the detriment of our institutions and especially our French-language schools.

In closing, the FFTNL would like to present several recommendations that we believe are consistent with the priorities of the government and our communities.

First, that the government integrate a francophone lens into the express entry system to help us at least partially compensate for a disadvantage in attracting newcomers.

Second, that the government work at the community and regional levels to promote francophone immigration, taking into account the specific characteristics of these communities and regions.

Third, that the provincial government be asked to serve as policy levers for francophone immigration, and that the partnership between the two levels of government be strengthened.

Finally, that communities have the tools they need to take effective strategic action on francophone immigration in the areas of immigrant recruitment, settlement and integration, and particularly the operational capacity to offer direct services.

Thank you, Mr. Chair and members of the committee, for your attention.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Mr. Corbineau.

I now give the floor to Mr. Hominuk and Mr. Kashama, from the Assemblée de la francophonie de l'Ontario.

[Peter Hominuk, Assemblée de la francophonie de l'Ontario]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

This year, we are celebrating 400 years of French presence in Ontario. This is the 400th anniversary of Samuel de Champlain's arrival in the Penetanguishene area. We are going to hand out a logo showing Champlain's astrolabe and a button saying “Ontario 400”. The logo has been adopted by the province and the community in order to recognize our 400 years of French presence.

My name is Peter Hominuk, the director general of the Assemblée de la francophonie de l'Ontario, the AFO. I represent the organization on Citizenship and Immigration Canada's steering subcommittee for Ontario. I am accompanied by Ferdinand Kashama, the Assemblée's vice president.

Thank you for inviting us to this discussion on your current study of Government of Canada programs for francophone immigration into official-language minority communities.

First, it is important to point out that the AFO, as an umbrella organization and the voice of the Franco-Ontarian community, does not claim to have a monopoly on expertise in immigration matters. However, as the representative of the Franco-Ontarian community, the Assemblée is keenly interested in francophone immigration matters and their impact on the development of our community. Indeed, our community's survival and vitality greatly depends on the arrival of francophone immigrants. Welcoming, including and integrating new francophone immigrants into our great community is therefore a priority for us. We have the ability to bring together and coordinate and it is our wish to use those abilities for the benefit of francophone immigration in Ontario.

Ontario has the largest minority francophone community outside Quebec, numbering 611,500 individuals. According to the last census, the growth in the francophone population is largely the result of the arrival of francophone immigrants. So we can see the degree to which francophone immigration is important for French-speaking Ontario.

In 2006, immigrants represented 13.7% of the francophones in Ontario. According to Statistics Canada's last census, Ontario takes in more than 50% of the French-speaking immigrants who settle outside Quebec.

In terms of immigration, Ontario is in the unique position of being able to maintain three support networks for francophone immigration, one for the east, one for the centre and southwest and one for Ontario's north. For us in Ontario, the responsibility for immigration is also shared between the province and the federal government.

In recent years, the province has indicated that it wants to play a more and more active role in this area. In March 2012, the Government of Ontario announced the development of its very first immigration strategy, including an expert roundtable on immigration in Ontario. Ontario set itself a target of 5% of its immigrants being francophone, while the federal target is 4%.

In March 2015, the Ontario government tabled a bill designed to encourage the establishment of immigration programs and supporting the integration of immigrants and other individuals in Ontario. The preamble to the bill mentions that one of the objectives is to allow communities across Ontario, including Franco-Ontarian communities, to attract, welcome and integrate immigrants. You will understand that we attach great importance to francophone immigration to ensure that our language endures, our culture is enriched and the linguistic duality of our province is strengthened.

Quebec is the bastion of the Canadian francophonie, but francophones outside Quebec form the buttresses that prevent Canada from falling divided into two linguistic groups that are identified with a specific territory, with Quebec speaking French and the rest of Canada speaking English. Francophones outside Quebec are essential in building a Canadian identity on the two official languages. They show the face of a Canada that is bilingual from coast to coast, thereby allowing any Canadian with one of the two official languages to move anywhere.

Like Quebec, the AFO urges francophone immigration to be wholly coordinated and, as a result, urges that an action plan be developed that makes use of the structures and initiatives already in place. It is important that all immigration initiatives be included in a more comprehensive action plan that would include other services such as health, social services and language training, to name but a few. This comprehensive action plan should be placed in the hands of the francophone community, which is in a better position to understand its own needs, through its voice, the AFO.

It is in that context that the Assemblée makes the following recommendations.

It is imperative that existing community structures be improved so that the inclusion and integration of newcomers into our communities can be successful. Sufficient financial resources must be provided.

CIC must ensure that francophone officers are present at ports of entry in Ontario and must establish links between CIC services and francophone community groups.

Better support for secondary immigration must be considered. In other words, that CIC's financial resources for welcoming be transferred to the new province of destination when, for example, francophone immigrants arrive in Quebec and then settle in Ontario after a few months in Canada.

There must be better coordination between CIC, Ontario, and the francophone community in Ontario. The lack of coordination between these three key parties causes obvious difficulties.

CIC must also work more closely with the Government of Ontario to rapidly develop an action plan so that the target of 5% francophone immigration can be met.

We also recommend that the promotion abroad of French-speaking Canada outside Quebec be expanded, that the promotional tools be developed in partnership with the francophone communities and that those communities, and employers, be invited to all promotional activities overseas in order to offer potential immigrants the possibility of living in French outside Quebec.

We ask that CIC provide support for community stakeholders that goes beyond the one-stop shop approach in remote minority communities where organizations cover vast areas. In other words, the federal government must adopt an approach based on sharing resources and locations.

The break-even point for remote minority regions must be adjusted to reflect the reality of those regions and that other services be added to a bidding process if investments are not justified.

Together with the professional organizations, CIC must be part of a process to harmonize and standardize terminology and the qualification criteria for coming to work here.

We recommend that employability training be provided by francophone or bilingual institutions that are capable of monitoring how immigrants are included in Ontario's francophone community.

That said, we need an approach that will involve the four main actors, so that immigration plays a key role in the vitality of the French-language minority community in Ontario and in Canada.

First, this means government agencies, provincially and federally, so that programs can be coordinated with a view to integrating newcomers into the francophone minority. This involves, first, negotiations to establish a policy framework for immigrant selection and, second, an evaluation of the extent to which quantifiable objectives, including the number of immigrants who can speak French, where they settle in Canada, and the demand for services tailored to their specific needs.

Then it means welcoming organizations that are suitably equipped to expose newcomers to our francophone reality in order to help them in their search for economic and social opportunities. This includes both the possibility of working in a francophone or bilingual environment and the availability of government services in French.

We must also mention the francophone immigrant support networks in the three major regions of Ontario; they allow Ontario's francophone community to enjoy coordinated recommendations, planning, and initiative and project implementation in francophone immigration matters. The networks are also demonstrating collaborative leadership in francophone immigration by bringing together partners in various sectors—education, communities, employment, municipalities, culture, health—leadership that develops links between the newcomers and the established community. This suggests developing social policies and implementing ways to support their integration into the francophone community. For young people, these links very often begin with sports and in school. Hence the importance of schools in integrating newcomers.

The final actors are the newcomers themselves. They need to be made aware, before they are selected, of the possibility of living in the French-language community. They must be exposed to the reality of Canada's linguistic duality and of its official language minorities, as well as of the advantages of being able to communicate in both of Canada's official languages.

Finally, the AFO supports the 32 recommendations drawn up by Ontario's Expert Roundtable on Immigration in September 2012, but I will not read those 32 recommendations.

Thank you for your time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you.

The floor now goes to Mr. Boileau and Mr. Ghaleb, from the Office of the French Language Services Commissioner.

[François Boileau, Commissioner, Office of the French Language Services Commissioner]

Good afternoon, and thank you very much for inviting me today. It's a great pleasure to be here.

I am accompanied by Mohamed Ghaleb, our Project Manager, Investigations, Research and Surveillance. Before you, therefore, you see one third of the Office of the French Language Services Commissioner of Ontario.

The commissioner's office was established in 2007 to ensure the effective implementation of the French Language Services Act, which was unanimously adopted by the Legislative Assembly of Ontario in 1986. Like our counterparts at federal level, Graham Fraser and his team, and in New Brunswick, Katherine d'Entremont, whom you had the pleasure of hearing from a few weeks ago, the commissioner's office receives complaints from the public. We work together with the Government of Ontario to make sure that those complaints are treated systematically and in order, and that changes are made to the way in which French-language services are processed by the government and the institutions in the province of Ontario.

Immigration is a priority issue of my office since its inception. In fact, my first recommendation as commissioner concerned this issue. I had asked the minister responsible for francophone affairs to review the definition of the francophone population of Ontario in order to ensure that it adequately reflects the new reality of this population.

As such, Ontario's francophone population has benefited, since June 2009, from a new inclusive definition of francophone, a first in Canada. The inclusive definition of francophone, or IDF, reflects the diversity of Franco-Ontarians, regardless of their place of birth, ethnic origin or religious affiliation.

Ontario has also been active on the national scene through the Ministerial Conference on the Canadian Francophonie, calling for the IDF alone to be used to count the Franco-Ontarian population, even though none of its federal, provincial and territorial government counterparts have yet to follow suit.

In 2011, there were, according to the IDF, 611,500 francophones in Ontario, accounting for nearly 5% of the total population. There is no question that, aside from the statistical exercise, the adoption of the IDF is enabling newcomers to identify as francophones in Ontario and takes their contribution to the francophone community into account, thereby reinforcing their feeling of belonging to their host community.

Thus, if we want to attract them to our francophone communities, francophone immigrants must be an integral part of their new community. The IDF certainly contributes.

In Ontario, responsibility for newcomer integration programs, for example with settlement, language training and employment, is shared between the Ministry of Citizenship, Immigration and International Trade of Ontario and the Department of Citizenship and Immigration of Canada.

There is certainly some overlap between programs, but the Ontario government has looser eligibility requirements than its federal counterpart. Nevertheless, it is important that, before and as soon as they arrive, immigrants realize that they can not only obtain service in French from the federal and provincial governments, but also live in French, such as applying to have their children educated in French and obtaining community assistance in French. We need to make the newcomers aware of those services and opportunities

As our friend from AFO, Peter Hominuk, said earlier, in 2012, the Ontario government announced the development of its first immigration strategy to attract more highly skilled workers. This clear goal and this leadership by the government were reflected in the announcement of a 5% target for francophone immigration, which will contribute to the vitality and the social, economic and cultural development not only of the francophone community, if it is reached, but also of Ontario society as a whole.

Since the publication of Ontario's first immigration strategy in 2012, the provincial government has undertaken a number of actions. Notably, a working group was formed to develop measures for achieving the 5% target under the leadership of the Minister of Citizenship, Immigration and International Trade. As you know, immigration is an area of jurisdiction shared between the federal government and the provinces, which means that the various levels of government must join forces to facilitate progress.

This is why my colleagues Katherine d'Entremont and Graham Fraser and myself wanted to lead by example. by stating four guiding principles. More recently, in 2014, Graham Fraser and I published a joint report to present an overview and analysis of the issues surrounding immigration to francophone communities. We formulated eight recommendations, primarily to the federal government, but also to the Government of Ontario.

These recommendations deal with: support for French-speaking immigrants through francophone institutions and organizations; information and resources for French-speaking newcomers; cooperation with provincial and territorial governments; accountability, and incentives for employers to recruit and select francophone and bilingual workers.

During this celebration period of the 400th anniversary of the French presence in Ontario, and as we approach the 150th anniversary of Confederation in 2017, we believe that the two levels of government must join forces and show leadership so that immigration truly contributes to the development and vitality of francophone minority communities and must ensure that Canada's changing demographic mosaic continues to be in line with the specificities of Canadian society.

As proof, we see that, although Ontario's francophone population represents 5% of the total population in the province, 2% of the immigrant population had French as its first official language spoken, according to Statistics Canada's 2011 census data.

As is the case for the Canadian population as a whole, we need immigration to offset the sharp decline in the birth rate and higher rates of population aging. Immigration has a direct impact on the community's vitality.

We also need immigration to ensure the continuity of French-language services. For example, we will need more nurses to take care of our aging population, and more early childhood educators, teachers of French and many other subjects.

It is clear that, over the years, Canada and Ontario francophone communities have benefited less from immigration than have the anglophone majority communities.

In conclusion, I believe that our governments must act now to redress the current immigration imbalance affecting francophone communities. We have formulated a plan with eight recommendations. If you remember anything from my presentation only, let it be those eight recommendations. It is time to act on them.

I will be pleased to answer any questions you and your colleagues may have.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Mr. Boileau.

We have one hour and 15 minutes for questions and comments.

We will start with Mr. Gravelle.

[Claude Gravelle, NDP, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I would also like to thank the witnesses for joining us today.

Unfortunately, I will not be able to be here for the entire meeting.

I have some questions, and I will start with Mr. Hominuk and Mr. Kashama.

I live in Sudbury, in northern Ontario. There used to be an organization called “Contact interculturel francophone de Sudbury”. I do not know if you are familiar with that organization. Its goal was to help new francophone immigrants to adapt to northern Ontario.

We take a lot of things for granted, like going to the bank, housing or employment for the spouse or the young people. The organization was funded by the government but, two years ago, there were cuts and the services it was providing were unfortunately transferred to two places, to Ottawa and to the YMCA in Sudbury, a bilingual organization. Personally, I see bilingual organizations as anglophone organizations. The effect was to reduce immigration to northern Ontario because no one was helping immigrants to settle there any longer.

Can you provide any comments about that organization, which is now operated from Ottawa?

[Peter Hominuk]

Thank you for the question, Mr. Gravelle.

All we know is that, at some stage, Contact interculturel francophone de Sudbury lost its contract with CIC. The Conseil économique et social d’Ottawa-Carleton, which looks after the network in eastern Ontario, was given the mandate for one year. It deals with building, or continuing to build, the network in the south. At that point, the staff changed. I know that CIC has issued a call for tenders in recent months in order to find a new group that can run the network in northwestern and northeastern Ontario on a little more permanent basis.

The AFO has made its views known about CIC’s conditions. We hope that a francophone group from northern Ontario will be the next to coordinate the network. We are firm believers in the idea of “by and for”. In other words, the work has to be done “by and for” people in the north and it must be a francophone organization that provides the services.

[Claude Gravelle, NDP, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you.

It is much easier to coordinate arrivals for people arriving from abroad if you are right there in the north, rather than in Ottawa, say. For someone from Ottawa to be helping someone to find housing in Sudbury makes no sense, as I see it. Hopefully, northern Ontario will be responsible for that.

Earlier, you talked a little about the 400th anniversary of the presence of French in Ontario. Are you satisfied with the grants allocated by the federal government? Have you received sufficient assistance to organize a major celebration?

[Peter Hominuk]

That is not an easy question to answer. We are happy with the investments that have been made by the Government of Canada. They are not as extensive as those made in Quebec or Atlantic Canada but Canadian Heritage has still been investing in recent months. We in Ontario will be able to hold an appropriate celebration.

[Claude Gravelle, NDP, Nickel Belt, ON]

Okay. Thank you.

Mr. Boileau, what is the biggest challenge in your office?

[François Boileau]

Thank you, sir.

[Claude Gravelle, NDP, Nickel Belt, ON]

Can you sum it up in two words?

[François Boileau]

My two words are “inadequate resources”.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[François Boileau]

We receive more than one complaint per day. That may not seem like a lot, given the number of francophones in Ontario, but is still a big challenge because the types of complaints vary a lot. Some complaints are very easy to handle and need absolutely nothing in the way of investigation, just a good contact. Our contacts in the departments can help us to change a text or correct errors here and there. Mistakes like that are quite rare because the Government of Ontario does a very good job with its documents in French and its websites. Generally, all the guidelines for communication in French are followed quite well.

However, there are more complex complaints, such as, for example, when there is a shortage of health services in French in the Peel region. That is another story. Complaints of that kind cannot be settled immediately just by calling someone. They are a lot more complex. We have received complaints about the lack of post-secondary programs in French in the south-central Ontario region. After we investigated, we found that from 0% to 3% of the programs offered in English were also offered in French. Complaints like that need much more detailed analysis, of course.

I will end with another example, if I may. Take someone who has had issues with a local children’s aid society and whose two children, aged 2 and 4, have been taken in by a foster family that is unilingual English. If the social workers assigned to the case are anglophone as well, it means that the children have no ability to interact. They likely will not understand what is happening. At least we try to give them one more opportunity. That is the kind of complaint that gets us worked up and that keeps up very busy. We get them very frequently.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

You have one minute left.

[Claude Gravelle, NDP, Nickel Belt, ON]

Okay.

Mr. Hominuk, many immigrants choose to stay in northern Ontario, but they often don't stay there for a long time. Are there enough immigrants to replace them as they leave? Are we losing ground?

[Peter Hominuk]

I cannot specifically tell you about immigration in the north. Most francophone immigrants who settle in Ontario go to southern Ontario and fewer immigrants go to eastern Ontario. There are not many in the north. I know that the network and the groups in the north are developing immigrant retention strategies there, but that is not the trend right now. We will have to develop strategies.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Okay. Thank you.

We will now move to Mr. Gourde.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My thanks to the witnesses for being here this morning.

My first question is for the witnesses from the various provinces, Ms. Hébert, Mr. Corbineau and Mr. Hominuk.

Why do francophone immigrants settle in your provinces? Is it for economic or family reunification purposes? What services do they choose to use?

When they accept a job in your provinces, can they be close to an official language minority community, a francophone community? Do they subsequently choose to move closer to a francophone community because they decided to settle in your province for a longer term?

That's basically an indirect question. In other words, are they staying in your province for only one year and then leaving quite quickly to settle in another province such as Quebec? Or do they stay in the province and settle for a longer term to then get closer to a francophone community, when they don't necessarily have the chance to establish themselves close to a francophone community because of their employment?

They don't always work in French because there are also francophones who have jobs where English is spoken exclusively.

[Anne Hébert]

I don't know the exact number, but over 80% of francophone immigrants who come in through New Brunswick decide to stay there. I don't have the statistics, but we often hear that francophone immigrants come to New Brunswick because they know that it is a province where they will be able to live in French. However, there are obstacles. There are not many jobs where you can work exclusively in French, where you can be unilingual francophone and easily find a job. That is one of the biggest challenges.

We are doing a better job than we did of informing them about that before they come here. In the past, we would attract them by telling them that our francophone community had great vitality, but we realized that, even though we were able to draw them here, we could not always keep them. I think they now settle here more as they know what to expect.

There are one or two programs that directly deal with the economy and that enable immigrants to come here more quickly. There is a program provided by the New Brunswick government and it works quite well, except that our quotas are comprehensive, meaning that there is no anglophone quota or francophone quota. The anglophone and francophone quotas are unofficial. We would love to reach those quotas, but we don't slow down anglophone immigration because we have trouble catching up on the francophone side. That is a problem.

Have I answered your question properly?