No, I wasn't. There wasn't a pension subcommittee.
Anyway, there were lots of people there.
I would like to recommend to the committee--and I know you're very busy and you're talking to a lot of people--that you invite three staff relations officers who are the very brightest, and excellent, who pushed this outsourcing. They are Kevin MacDougall, from Winnipeg; Don Taylor, from Saskatchewan; and Bruce Morrisson, from British Columbia. I'm sure they will give you a good accounting on what went on in the pension advisory committee. I can assure you that if we had known that any of this was going on, we would have put a stop to it much earlier than we did. It's very unfortunate that this didn't come forward.
There's a question as to when Mr. Macaulay knew. If he had known earlier--I don't know when he knew--and had brought it forward, I assure you that we wouldn't have gotten into the mess we did.