Public Accounts Committee on April 13th, 2010

[Hedy Fry, Liberal, Vancouver Centre, BC]

Yes, Mr. Yeates, you agree with me. I'm asking what happened. I want to know what happened.

[Neil Yeates]

Yes.

I'm going to ask Mr. Linklater to speak to the work that's been done on the portal and so on.

[Hedy Fry, Liberal, Vancouver Centre, BC]

Thank you.

[Les Linklater]

Certainly.

Indeed, work has proceeded with the provinces and territories on a foreign credential recognition portal, work that is shared between CIC and HRSDC as well as the provinces and territories.

On the website, the “Going to Canada” portal has a subset and also links to HRSDC and CIC. There is a great deal of information around the credential recognition process as provinces have provided content. The federal government is supporting the provinces in assisting them to develop the content that they wish to put on the portal and make it available to applicants both overseas and in Canada.

[Hedy Fry, Liberal, Vancouver Centre, BC]

Thanks, Mr. Linklater.

I know this is happening. I just need to find out what happened between 2005 and now that this all went into a hole in the ground somewhere and it's taken all this time to start reinventing a new wheel. That's the question I'm asking. It's about the accountability of what went on. All that data, all that information, a full plan--what happened to it?

[Janice Charette]

Perhaps I can try to respond, Mr. Chair.

Rather than reinventing the wheel--to use the language the member used--I think what we've tried to describe, or what I've tried to describe and perhaps have not done a very good job of, is that in fact it's been a series of efforts as opposed to going around in a circle. It's all been building on...back to work that was started back in 2003-04, with the five-point action plan, working with the regulatory bodies and some of the professional associations.

We've put in place some of these new tools, including the portal. We've been working with those organizations to try to clarify processes. The Foreign Credentials Referral Office takes that a next step further.

The framework allows us to make sure, and says that all governments--as you know, provinces and territories have a significant role to play in establishing the standards and requirements within their jurisdictions--are committed to making sure that these processes are happening in a way that's fair, transparent, more timely, and more consistent. I think it's all actually working toward the same objective that you describe. It's progressive rather than restarting.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

The chair has a couple of quick questions, if he may.

On page 3 of the Auditor General's report--this question is to the CIC--it says the CIC still has little assurance that overall decisions by these officers are fair and consistent.

We've all seen situations where there is not consistency, sometimes in how they're treated through our offices, or in how some of the applicants are being treated. Yet it says that while the department has developed a quality assurance framework that is available, immigration program managers are not required to use it to report it. Why not?

[Neil Yeates]

I'll ask Madam Deschênes to speak to our work on quality assurance.

[Claudette Deschênes, Assistant Deputy Minister, Operations, Department of Citizenship and Immigration]

Over the years there's been an attempt to implement an integrated program on quality assurance. We agree with the Auditor General that we need to make sure it is systematic. Temporary workers are now coming to Canada and being processed for immigration through Canadian offices. We're setting up a framework so that all of them have to report in a systematic fashion, and we are moving the work to be more integrated. It's a matter that we should have had it in place in a more systematic fashion, but it's being put in place now. We'll continue to grow it to ensure that we cover the whole range of our programs and we can look at quality assurance through the different programs and how it can impact, one to the other.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Thank you.

The Auditor General has also stated that efficiency gains will be limited until the information technology system is implemented. It's been under development for 10 years.

I'd like to know where the ball has to stop here. It's in one of three departments. Is it in CIC, because you're unable to define or apply what you really want in this system? Is it in Public Works, because they have not been able to effectively secure or appropriate? Or is it because Treasury Board has not provided the authority for the necessary funds?

In which department does the problem lie? Ten years is unacceptable.

[Neil Yeates]

GCMS has had a difficult history, as you've noted, Chair. There are issues around the scope of the project and the cost of the project. Whenever you have long-term IT projects, things keep changing--your environment; you go back and change the system. There have been some big lessons there about these big IT projects. So it's been a tremendous challenge.

The good news is that GCMS has successfully been in use since 2004 for citizenship--so okay, that part of the system has worked. The case management part for processing for immigration will be rolled out in June; we're on track for that. It's within the budget that was re-scoped. So we're on budget now. Starting in June, it will roll out over the next year to all of the missions around the world. So we are finally getting to the point we need to reach.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Thank you.

Madame Faille.

[Meili Faille, Bloc, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Ms. Fraser, based on the evidence we've heard today, what is your understanding of the changes the department will be making to the Temporary Foreign Worker Program? Are you satisfied with what the department has presented to us?

[Sheila Fraser]

We'll obviously have to wait to see what the ministerial instructions are, but, from what I understand, the program will be even more restricted. I don't know exactly how it will be restricted, but the objective is to limit the number of applications. We're beginning to see that the number of applications is tending to be much larger than the number that can be processed in a reasonable period of time.

[Meili Faille, Bloc, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Thank you.

You mentioned earlier that people who filed applications before February 27, 2008 could be reimbursed.

Can you give us the procedure that must be followed, statistics on the subject and the documentation on the directives and policies that apply to refunds?

Thank you.

[Neil Yeates]

I'll ask Madam Deschênes to speak to the refund processing.

[Meili Faille, Bloc, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

You could simply write to us.

[Neil Yeates]

Okay. Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Mr. Lee is next, please.

[Derek Lee, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you.

I have two quick questions on the global case management system that's been put in place.

I somewhat feel an audit is coming, given that at the end of the day it's probably going to be about half a billion dollars in development and implementation. I would ask the department this. Do you plan to get out in front to evaluate the effectiveness of the program? I know my friends on the government side will say we have to show all the cost efficiencies that will be generated by these great investments.

That's question one.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

I noticed Madam Fraser had a comment on your statement.

[Derek Lee, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Okay. Well, we'll get there.

Secondly, to the immigration department, this is my second short question.

The second big elephant in the room in terms of the immigration program, in my view, is the capacity of our receiving communities to actually receive and settle new immigrants. There are three or four major receiving communities, along with some smaller ones across the country. There are limits to our capacity to take in immigrants. We can't speed up the process and bring in a million immigrants in one year.

Has the department done an evaluation on the capacity of these communities to receive the volume they're capable of receiving? How does it have an impact on the department's decision on whether or not to process it more quickly and on the volume you can process in one year?

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Before the response, we will hear from Madam Fraser, followed by the department.

[Sheila Fraser]

I want to assure the committee that we are actually undertaking an audit. We did an audit in 2006 on large IT developments across government. We're doing a follow-up on that for the spring of 2011.

[Derek Lee, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you.