Yes. To be very clear, on the governance point—and I don't want to get too bogged down in this—I do not have any executive authority to tell a deputy minister or any public servant, outside of the Privy Council Office, what to do.
I do recommend promotion, movement, and performance pay to the Prime Minister, and I'm able to do that through an annual cycle of agreements on what their goals are. We review performance, and on that basis I recommend performance pay. I take full responsibility for advising the Prime Minister on the deployment of deputies and whether they stay or whether they move. These commitments do have leverage, and I've used them in specific areas, such as mental health and others.
I don't know how exactly you measure organizational culture. I don't know what they would report back with. On the pay system, I think it was important to make clear to Canadians that departments were taking pay seriously on things that they had some control over—training, emergency pay, and relief. These were things they could make some strides on in their own department. I asked everybody to write in and say what they were doing. I told them in advance that we would put them all on the Internet so that Canadians, including parliamentarians, could take a look at them. That's a technique we can use.
For the best way to get a culture, I think I'll defer to expertise on that. It's a different methodology. You have to do surveys. You have to do deep dives. I just don't think you should be lured into making general statements that there is a certain culture across 300 organizations and all of its subunits spread across all of the geographic locations. There are some very strong and healthy organizational cultures and there are some very troubled ones. The art is going to be knowing which is which and to have the right incentives and feedback loops to correct the ones that need correcting and to emulate and copy the ones that are strong.