Public Accounts Committee on Dec. 13th, 2016

[Jean Lebel]

May I answer?

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, David Christopherson]

Mr. Arya, you went a little longer, as it was. Mr. Lebel, you may finish, but he may not ask another question.

Please, continue.

[Jean Lebel]

Thank you very much.

On the fact that India does not accept international aid.... We are a research-based agency, and we are funding research. We are providing support towards the development of research capacity in regions of the world that the mandate of the centre describes in its act, and we are providing those funds to researchers and institutions.

Specifically, in this brochure.... By the way, this is not an IDRC brochure. Canadian Geographic publishes in an electronic version a series of stories of IDRC projects for kids in grades 9 and 10. What you have there is about a project that we have been supporting towards the elimination of violence against women in India, following the very publicized case of a rape of a woman in a bus. It was work that we were already engaged in, and it has led to a number of actions.

I'll give you two very illustrative cases.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, David Christopherson]

Very quickly, please.

[Jean Lebel]

In Mumbai, every police station is now trained to receive cases of rape.

Secondly, on the forensic tool kit, India was using the two-finger test, measuring the entry of the vagina to determine if this was a case of rape. This is now out, because this test is irrelevant. Plus, for women, it's quite disturbing. There are other methods present, far more modern and effective, to establish if you have been a victim of rape. Our research has contributed to this in India.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, David Christopherson]

Given the subject matter, I wanted to offer an opportunity for a fulsome answer.

Mr. Arya, you'll have the floor next, after Mr. McColeman, so I'll be coming right back to you, sir, and you can pick up on any line of questioning you wish at that time.

It's now time to move back to Mr. McColeman, who now has five minutes.

[Phil McColeman, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

When you fund research projects, who owns the research after the project is completed?

[Jean Lebel]

The research is always owned by the researcher. IDRC helped to build the platform. Our researchers, whom we are supporting—we're saying “our researchers”, but they are researchers of their own institution—are delivering the keynotes. They are using the research in order to find the best way to have an influence on public policy to improve the life and livelihood of people.

[Phil McColeman, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Is all the research you're funding in the public realm?

[Jean Lebel]

Absolutely. It's all available freely and openly on our website and various platforms.

[Phil McColeman, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Is that a condition of getting a grant? Do you call them grants when you fund a project?

[Jean Lebel]

Yes, it's a research grant.

[Phil McColeman, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Is that a condition of getting a grant, that the research be available?

[Jean Lebel]

Absolutely.

[Phil McColeman, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

That's good to know.

Obviously, you scored very well on the audit, and I'll echo that from other members. It's very difficult to get an actual grasp—I'll speak for myself—of the impact of the types of things you've described—the partnership with Tim Hortons in terms of helping to mitigate climate change where they buy their product from.

Give us one or two more highlights—or maybe three, if we have time here—of a very small project that had a huge impact. You mentioned you've been with the agency for 22 years or....

[Jean Lebel]

Twenty years.

[Phil McColeman, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

You've seen it. You know what this is all about and how important it is.

What are three that stick at the top of your mind: small, medium, and large scale?

[Jean Lebel]

On a small scale, through a grant of $200,000, we helped Mexico get DDT eliminated from their malaria control program through the parallel agreement of NAFTA on the environment at the end of the 1990s. The model we used in Mexico that worked with the researcher there was translated for the entire Central America region with the elimination of DDT for malaria control. That's a very good example.

When the Ebola vaccine happened, IDRC had been funding research on emerging and re-emerging diseases for over 15 years. When the Ebola crisis happened, we knew that the Public Health Agency of Canada had the vaccine. The Canadian Institutes of Health Research was ready to fund a vaccine trial. IDRC had the contact in the field in Guinea, and we were in a network with WHO and other agencies with Global Affairs to launch the testing of the Ebola vaccine in Guinea and to get a 100% success rate in eliminating the transmission of Ebola.

Is it over? No, because this vaccine needs to be tested in different conditions under different regimes, and that's the nature of research. That's an investment of $7 million for Canada altogether, I believe, that makes a very big change in the world.

I will give you another example that I don't often use, but one that tells a lot about the work of IDRC. When Nelson Mandela became the ANC chief, he came to Canada—under I think it was the Mulroney government—and asked for help for the transition to an anti-apartheid system without bloodshed. The government asked IDRC what we could do.

We said we would sponsor research with researchers from South Africa who were part of the diaspora or who were in South Africa, to look at the justice system, institutions, government, urban design, and research design. The research system is the same as Canada with NSERC and SSHRC, the granting councils.

Nelson Mandela was elected. Over half of his cabinet was composed of ministers who had received grants from IDRC in their careers. This is an impact for me that we don't measure. We cannot predict this, but the influence it has is still lasting, because any time there's a South African delegation in town, they come to IDRC, and we work with them. We don't interfere with their business, but we provide support in places where they feel there is a need, and our Canadian taxpayers' money makes a difference in the lives of these people.

[Phil McColeman, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

One last question, quickly. How much of your budget is available for grants?

[Jean Lebel]

The budget currently is $138 million. From the parliamentary allocation, there is $100 million that goes straight into research grants.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, David Christopherson]

Thank you.

Over to Mr. Arya. You have the floor again, sir, for five minutes.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I knew David Malone when he was the president of IDRC. I even gave him an award. Since then, my question of whether IDRC is still relevant remains.

You mentioned the rape issue in India to sensationalize your work being done in India, but this project does not deal with that. It's a three-year evaluation study, but anyway we'll come to that within the limited time.

With your funding, when you talked about the joint activities, or the parallel, or whatever you call it, raising about $450 million, who manages the money? Suppose you got some funding from the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation and you are a partner there. Who is the dominant partner who manages that money?

[Jean Lebel]

The money that flows through IDRC is accountable to the IDRC board and through the Parliament of Canada. It's in our annual report.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

It is not that your money goes to the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation?

[Jean Lebel]

No.