All I'm saying is that the effect would be the same whether one wishes to call it a leak, which I won't in this case. I'll indulge you on that one point, but when we have any organization looking at this and asking if we have fairness in our tax system, I think they can say yes.
They might have issues with the Canada Revenue Agency. That's fine. That's democracy. Many Canadians have the ability to raise concerns about the CRA. There is an appeals process and so on and so forth, but it starts from the very basic understanding that the tax agency is fair and is not going to, for example, divulge information on a whim or on a request by a parliamentary committee for political purposes.
Where is it going? It's ultimately going towards creating an environment of mistrust that organizations, whether they are charities or businesses.... The Conservatives used to style themselves as the party of businesses, of the free market, of entrepreneurship. Business needs, almost by definition, a level playing field. That includes a tax agency that is fair. If a tax agency is asked, in this case by a parliamentary committee, to reveal the information of a particular organization.... We're talking about charities here. It could just as well be a business. There is nothing preventing a future committee from looking at Mr. McCauley's motion and saying, “Let's gather the information that the CRA has about this business”. Then the level playing field I talk about is not in place.
That is a huge problem. This is an advanced democracy. This is a G7 country. Yes, we have many challenges, but we're still one of the most advanced democracies in the world, where people come to learn the practice of democracy. Now we're going to ask our tax agency to reveal the confidential information it has about a charity organization. There are huge problems that come from that.
Ultimately, the T3010 form that is mentioned and that Mr. McCauley is seized with—let's just be sure of our terms here—is an income tax return for charities. That is what that form is, so the information in that is quite sensitive. I wouldn't ask you, Mr. Chair, or any colleague here to see your income tax return. That's a private matter. Could you imagine if we started asking the Canada Revenue Agency for individuals' tax returns? It's not that different in terms of what's being asked for here.
This is an enormous breach of parliamentary obligation that can't be allowed to stand for the reasons I've mentioned, which are new reasons that build upon what Mrs. Shanahan has already offered. Committees set precedents. That is the case. We have to be very careful about the precedent that is set here.
What will the business community think when it becomes clear, as it is already becoming clear, that it's the Conservatives who are trying to obtain particular documents that are protected under privacy provisions? What will they think, if this were to go through, about what this Parliament is all about? They have privacy rights, as all Canadians have the right to privacy. It's a very curious and strange motion and amendment that the Conservatives have put forward for that reason. Again, it's about fairness, a level playing field. This is what's required in the charitable sector, in business and in all realms of Canadian society and democratic life.
I see that my colleague has something that she wants to share, and I'll give up the floor in a moment. I'm interested to hear what Mr. McCauley says, particularly on this point about protections. I'm stunned that someone who has been a parliamentarian for so long has neglected to put that forward.
To go back to my other point about precedent setting, I mentioned an organization that represents the gun lobby. It's probably the lead organization in the country when it comes to lobbying on guns. If the Conservatives want to go down this path, it opens up the floor entirely. I'd love to hear what Mr. Desjarlais would have to say on this.
They want to know about the ins and outs of a particular charity organization or not-for-profit organization. They've used the Pierre Elliott Trudeau Foundation in this case. They must understand that this does open the path for any member of this committee to put forward a motion to obtain information from any organization, whether it's relating to the gun lobby or other organizations that seem to be close to the Conservative Party and actually are close to the Conservative Party.
I'm not sure that they've thought this through. There is a domino effect to what they are trying to pursue with respect to the Pierre Elliott Trudeau Foundation. I'm not saying that this is the direction the committee should go, Mr. Chair. Again, I put forward an idea. I don't know if colleagues across the way have considered it. I know the Conservatives won't, as I've said.
Colleagues in the Bloc and colleagues in the NDP, I am ready to put forward a motion that would have us get back to what this committee is all about, which is to delve in and understand things like climate change. We could look at other things like poverty, for example, and what the Auditor General says about where things are at as far as poverty is concerned in Canada.
I do note, Mr. Chair—and it is relevant to the conversation because I am going to mention the Auditor General—I would love to know what the Auditor General would have to say on the plight and position of children living in poverty in the modern day. I know that we have seen some substantial declines in child poverty. The Auditor General could look at the overall landscape, not just in terms of federal policy but provincial and municipal policy, as those policies relate to what we do on the federal side. That would be a much more serious and substantive approach to take with respect to what this committee is all about.
Instead, we're putting forward a motion that, if taken to—I used the phrase before—its logical conclusion, would have us examine the ins and outs of the gun lobby. The Conservatives are opening a huge can of worms here for themselves. It's stunning. Let's look at their income tax return. Let's look at that T3010 form, for example. Is that something that the Canadian Coalition for Firearm Rights is interested in divulging? I would think not, Mr. Chair.
Let's better understand their political activities. If they want to politicize this committee, then naturally, by definition, they want to politicize the analysis of charity organizations. They are trying to do so with the Pierre Elliott Trudeau Foundation.
Again, take that to its logical conclusion. What are the political activities of that particular organization—the Canadian Coalition for Firearm Rights—or other gun lobby organizations vis-à-vis the Conservative Party? Have they been involved in helping to craft the overall public safety policy of the Conservatives with respect to guns? We don't know that. Is there anything in CRA documents that would show particular relationships of that kind? Perhaps there are. Is there anything in terms of foreign funding to be concerned about, with the National Rifle Association, for example? Are they involved in helping to fund particular gun lobby organizations?
I won't only focus on one. There are a few that we could put forward in terms of a motion. I think we would have opposition support for that because, while there are differences between the Bloc, the NDP and the Liberals—many differences—there is much more in common among the Bloc, the NDP and the Liberals on things like gun policy and responsible gun ownership. We saw this recently with Bill C-21 and there are other examples. The Conservatives are going down a path where this can of worms is a very real one for them.