Public Safety Committee on Jan. 30th, 2007

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

I'd like to call this meeting to order.

This is meeting 27 of the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National Security. We are considering the report of the commission of inquiry on the events relating to Maher Arar.

We have with us this afternoon Ms. Margaret Bloodworth, from the national security advisory to the Prime Minister, and associate secretary to the cabinet; and William Elliott, associate deputy minister.

Welcome, very much. We look forward to any information you can give us in relation to this topic. If you have any opening statements or you would like to introduce yourselves, I'll give you a moment to do that.

[Margaret Bloodworth, National Security Advisor to the Prime Minister & Associate Secretary to the Cabinet, Privy Council Office]

No, I do not have an opening statement, Mr. Chair. We're certainly here to try to answer any questions you have. I don't think I need to add anything further.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

Thank you.

And Mr. Elliott?

[William Elliott, Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness]

No, Mr. Chairman. I'm happy to be here and I'll try to respond to any questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

Okay.

As is the practice at this committee, we will now go over to the Liberal Party for seven minutes of questions and comments.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Breitkreuz.

This is my first meeting at the committee, so I'm very happy to start with this group from all parties around the table. We'll move forward constructively, I hope.

Welcome to our witnesses today. Both are very well-known professionals in their work.

I would like to add at the outset that in terms of the security of Canada, I feel that you serve us well and very professionally in your work in your specific areas.

As was stated by our chair, Ms. Bloodworth is the national security adviser to the Prime Minister, and as such is the most senior public servant on security matters and directly advises the Prime Minister. Mr. Elliott in his role does the same for the Minister of Public Safety. Since we've had a break and it's been a while, I'd like them both to take us back over some timelines to just get some basic facts.

So Mr. Elliott and Ms. Bloodworth, could you just state for the record whether you met with former Commissioner Zaccardelli in advance of his September 28 appearance before this committee? And if so, who was in attendance at that meeting?

[Margaret Bloodworth]

No, I did not, if you're talking in relation to this, or to the Arar report. I of course met Mr. Zaccardelli often on many things, but I did not meet him before his testimony in regard to this matter.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Mr. Elliott.

[William Elliott]

I did not meet the commissioner with respect to his testimony in advance of his appearance on September 28.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Okay.

Secondly, did either of you meet with former Commissioner Zaccardelli between September 28 and December 5? If you did meet with him during that period, did it concern his testimony of September 28?

[Margaret Bloodworth]

Sorry, was December 5 the second day he testified?

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Yes. I'm asking if you had meetings concerning his testimony from the meeting on September 28, in the interval between his first and second testimony times.

[Margaret Bloodworth]

I did have meetings with him; I did not discuss his testimony on September 28.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Okay.

Mr. Elliott.

[William Elliott]

After the commissioner's appearance on September 28...well, between the two appearances, I met with him on a number of occasions. On one occasion shortly after his testimony, in the margins of a meeting on another subject, he mentioned that he was anxious to come back before the committee. I met with him just days before his testimony on December 5. We didn't talk about the appearance, except that he indicated he was scheduled to appear on December 5.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Mr. Elliott, were there any other people in attendance at that meeting?

[William Elliott]

The Minister of Public Safety.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Okay, so the minister was there. Obviously, then, you were not briefing him, because he was fully aware of whatever conversation you had between the three of you by being present in the room.

[William Elliott]

Yes.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Thank you.

There was a letter sent by the former commissioner on November 2 to the chair of the committee, which was distributed to the members of the committee. Did either of you see that November 2 letter?

[Margaret Bloodworth]

Yes, I did. I saw it on, I believe, the Thursday or Friday of the week before he appeared December 5.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

That was the first time you saw the letter. Were you aware of the contents of the letter before that time?

[Margaret Bloodworth]

No, I wasn't aware there was a letter. I was certainly aware the commissioner wanted to go back to the committee, and then I was aware he was going to the committee, but I was not aware of the letter.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Mr. Elliott, same question.

[William Elliott]

I think I saw a copy of the letter a few days after it was sent.