Public Safety Committee on June 7th, 2006

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

I identified that in my opening remarks too, Joe, before you got here.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

I apologize for that.

You may have addressed this as well. There is legislation required if you're going to strip out the long guns. If you addressed that, I apologize for asking the question.

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

No, I haven't addressed that one yet. Did you want to ask that question?

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

When are we going to see the legislation, Mr. Minister, so we can vote it down?

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

I can't guarantee. I don't control the agenda. But I would like to have that proposed legislation on the table in front of you this month, June, with time for parliamentarians to look at it and time for us to consult with others who may, through any of you, suggest improvements.

I'm hoping that. I'm not subject to controlling the agenda; we're in your hands in that particular area. But I'm hoping this June you'll see it.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

My concern--just because of the democratic process--is that you'll take action to reduce the long gun registry, then lose that vote in the House, and then have to put it all back.

Have you considered how much that's going to cost?

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

I wouldn't--and neither would the government--be tabling legislation that we intend to have defeated. I am hoping that when you see the new legislation, sufficient numbers of members of Parliament will be convinced as to its efficacy and will support it. I can't guarantee that. There's no control, at least in our caucus, on how people vote. We'll wait and see.

I really do think a majority of MPs in the House will see this as good legislation and will support it. I hope I'm right on that.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Don't you think it would be prudent, as opposed to irresponsible, to wait until the vote takes place before you start stripping the long gun registry out of the firearms registry?

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

It had to be dealt with immediately for the reason that literally tens of thousands of people were, for a variety of reasons, not able to comply with the law as we have it now. My feeling is that it's an untenable situation when you require people to comply, yet you don't allow the provision for them to do that. In a country like Canada, which believes in the rule of law, that is an untenable situation.

So first what we had to do—we took the lead from the previous government—was put an amnesty in place. As you know, an amnesty does not say you can avoid the law; it says you must comply with the law. We hope that by next May 17, people will be complying with the law that will be there. Time will tell if it's the new law or the old one.

We just felt it was an untenable situation to require citizens to do something that so many sources were indicating was not effective. The Auditor General raised great concerns. There were so many questions being raised. There was the whole issue of the separate 25-page report related to funding that wasn't booked in the right year. To have all that confusion out there about the efficacy of the law itself was just not tenable.

That's why the amnesty was put in place.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

There's nothing in the Auditor General's report--

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

We'll have to come back to you, Mr. Comartin.

Mr. Ménard.

[Serge Ménard, Bloc, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

Mr. Chairman, I would like to ask a technical question. I will spare you a debate. I am withdrawing the motion I already tabled and am replacing it with this one. I was told that I really must table it. I sent it to the clerk, it was translated and the clerk has it. I'm giving you a notice of motion for the next sitting, and I have sent you that notice.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

Thank you.

Mr. Hawn.

[Serge Ménard, Bloc, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

Is it all right, Mr. Chairman? Was it tabled? Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

Yes, go ahead.

Mr. Hawn.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Minister Day, you said you asked for questions and also advice. Predictably, my advice to you is to keep doing what you're doing with respect to the long gun registry. I know a lot of frontline police officers in the RCMP and local police forces—as probably many of us do—and some at considerably more senior levels. I have not spoken to one who thinks that the firearms program, as it's constituted for the popular idea of its usefulness, is in fact useful. No police officer goes into any situation without assuming that there are firearms present, until proven otherwise.

My question, however, is on foreign intelligence. Will there be a significant increase—and I hope there will—in Canada's foreign intelligence gathering, in conjunction with our allies? From my point of view, the further out you can move things like intelligence and other protective measures, the better. Is there going to be a significant increase in Canada's ability to gather intelligence offshore?

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

We made it clear, as a campaign commitment during the election, that the capacity to gain foreign intelligence to protect Canada will be increased, and you can be confident of that.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Will it be in conjunction with our traditional allies or with new allies as well?

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

That capacity will open up. Our various forces do information sharing, but it's at different levels, depending on the quality of the relationship we have with another country. Again, I don't know if Mr. Judd wants to comment on this further, but there are countries that wouldn't be regarded as democracies with which we still share information on a limited basis. We don't restrict it just to our allies. Of course, it's done with an understanding of the limitations you have when dealing with people whose values on human rights, individual freedoms, and rule of law are different from yours. Even at those levels in those countries, where it's possible, there's information sharing.

I don't know if Mr. Judd wants to comment on that further.

[Jim Judd]

We do occasionally require information from countries, such as those described by Mr. Day, and particularly if it relates very specifically to our national security interest or, as another example, to the safety and security of the Canadian Forces in Afghanistan.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

We talked about the prison guards and obviously about the recent contract that was long overdue. Are there any other personnel issues of a similar variety that are brewing at the moment, Minister Day, within any of the areas you're responsible for?

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

Related to corrections?

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Not just related to corrections, but that's a big one that's hopefully been solved. Are there other personnel issues, relating to a similar kind of overdue contract situation or to difficulties brewing, that we should be aware?

[Stockwell Day, Conservative, Okanagan—Coquihalla, BC]

I think it's fair to say there are always human resources challenges in any organization, and those are dealt with as effectively as possible within the capacity of the various organizations. Those are always out there and always will be. Of course, they are overcome by the degree of willingness, on all parties' part, to overcome them, but that will continue and be ongoing. We hope to keep that to a minimal level in the way our various agencies approach these problems.

I'm not aware of any that have been out there as long at that four-year-plus problem.That was a long, aggravating situation. I'm not sure if there are any out there.

Does anybody else want to address this? If you have any surprises, you can tell me later.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!