Public Safety Committee on Oct. 8th, 2014

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

You have half a minute left.

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

My colleagues will likely have a chance to follow up on that question.

You briefly spoke about working with other police organizations across the country. I would like to know a bit more about how provincials governments are working together to try and better understand the elements that lead young people to become radicalized.

[Steven Blaney, Conservative, Lévis—Bellechasse, QC]

From a policy standpoint, I am in constant communication with my provincial counterparts. The combatting terrorism strategy falls primarily to law enforcement and national security agencies.

Mr. Paulson could likely provide more details about what has been happening. He said there were talks with the Toronto police. I'll let the commissioner talk some more about the strategy.

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

I'll have to interrupt here, Commissioner Paulson. We're well over the time. We'll hopefully get the response in another round or another question—either that or you can hold it to when it's convenient for you.

We will now go to Ms. James, please.

[Roxanne James, Conservative, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Do I have seven minutes or five?

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

You have five.

[Roxanne James, Conservative, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Thank you.

I'm just following up on some of the questions that Mr. Easter, my colleague across the way, asked regarding a mosque. I just came across another story on the leader of the Liberal Party, Justin Trudeau, visiting another mosque at the beginning of September. This was a different mosque from I think that Mr. Easter was speaking about. In fact, back in 2011 the imam at this mosque talked very favourably of following through with sharia law here in Canada. In some of the comments that are in this news story, he talks about stoning women, cutting hands off of thieves.

I thank Mr. Easter for bringing up that particular situation with the other mosque. Again, here's another one.

I'm just wondering, Minister, if you're aware of this particular story. Do Canadians need to be worried? Do we need to be alarmed? What is your reaction to this?

[Steven Blaney, Conservative, Lévis—Bellechasse, QC]

Thank you, Madam Parliamentary Secretary.

I have to say that I get shivers down my spine when I hear stories like that. Canada is a free country. Gender equality is a Canadian value. I think that we, as politicians, must do everything in our power to promote the Canadian values of gender equality and rule of law.

I find it troubling that Canadians or potential citizens are abusing our generosity and our tolerance by engaging in hate speech, which flies in the face of Canadian values. I believe that as politicians and citizens we should be outraged by those unacceptable statements and actions in a modern, contemporary society such as Canada.

Politicians must shoulder that responsibility more than others. We have a duty to distance ourselves, as much as we possibly can, from those statements because we should be proud of the progress women have made in Canadian society. We need to crack down on any threat to women's rights, and we must be uncompromising and steadfast. In Canada, we cannot let people say whatever they want if it could incite violence or impede the rights of other citizens.

As politicians, we need to distance ourselves from that. As politicians, we meet all kinds of people. However, when we meet certain people and are faced with certain problematic facts, it is our duty to clearly, unequivocally distance ourselves from those people.

[Roxanne James, Conservative, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Thank you, Minister.

Earlier in your testimony you talked about an individual who was sentenced to 10 years in prison. I'm wondering if you could mention any other cases where people have been charged or have received sentencing. I have a secondary question to that, if I have time, but I'll leave it at that question for now.

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

You still have another minute and a half.

[Roxanne James, Conservative, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Thank you.

[Steven Blaney, Conservative, Lévis—Bellechasse, QC]

So your question is...? I'm sorry.

[Roxanne James, Conservative, Scarborough Centre, ON]

You talked about one individual who had been arrested and charged and a 10-year sentence. I'm just wondering if you could talk about any other individuals who have been charged under any of our terrorism legislation and laws.

[Steven Blaney, Conservative, Lévis—Bellechasse, QC]

Yes, I can.

I can tell you about Mr. Yusufzai. He was the first one who was charged under the new Combating Terrorism Act. The individual is known to have travelled to Syria to join Islamist fighters. He was using a false passport.

There are a lot of challenges with those individuals who are willing to travel abroad. They are sometimes using passports.... We have experts here who can tell us a lot about their whereabouts. We have many cases.

One thing that is also shocking is that sometimes those individuals are coming from all stripes of society. In particular, there was an individual who was studying technology in university.

It is very important to do everything in our capacity to detect those who are willing to undertake terrorist activities.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

A point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Yes, Mr. Easter.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

I wonder, based on this discussion, if the minister could get posted on his website those mosques and religious centres across the country that we, as politicians, should avoid. I travel the country. I could go into a religious centre and not realize it's a threat.

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Mr. Easter, excuse me. No. That question is not in order for this meeting today.

We will just carry on. Pour cinq minutes, we now have Madam Doré Lefebvre.

[Rosane Doré Lefebvre, NDP, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I would like to thank Minister Blaney, Mr. Coulombe, Mr. Guimont and Mr. Paulson for being here today.

I think it is very important that we discuss these questions here in committee today. We really appreciate you being here to do that. If you don't mind, I would like to ask some budget-related questions. I want to talk about cuts to public safety budgets and terrorist attacks in Canada.

Minister, you talked about public safety cuts that would not affect services. However, when I look at the numbers, from the 2012 budget in particular, I can see that $143 million was cut from the Canada Border Services Agency. A total of 100 positions were cut from the immigration intelligence branch. That is the branch that monitors terrorist activities and transmits information to our international partners.

What is happening there? Will money be put back into that branch so that people can be hired back? How will we be able to apply the principles in the UN resolution, in addition to what you have presented today, with those kinds of cuts to public safety?

[Steven Blaney, Conservative, Lévis—Bellechasse, QC]

Thank you for your question.

As I indicated, it's important to allocate financial resources based on needs. I mentioned that nearly 20 agencies are involved in the fight against terrorism. As you saw this afternoon, the RCMP is working hard to combat terrorism. Resources are allocated based on needs. The Canada Border Services Agency plays an important role, and the agency needs to have access to tools. We invest heavily, in particular in the information exchange system.

Financial resources are important, but legislative tools and resources are just as important. As parliamentarians, one way in which we can help the Canada Border Services Agency combat terrorism is to develop tools to help Canada exchange information with its partners when Canadians travel.

I want to come back to the example I gave earlier. We are talking about information that is found in our passport, as well as the time and date we leave the country. This is unremarkable information, but in cases in which foreign terrorists want to travel through a third country—for example travelling through Turkey to get to Syria—this information becomes strategic. This information can provide context and and provide better ways to track terrorists.

With respect to the Canada Border Services Agency, we are talking about reallocating resources in several other agencies and about the fact that it's important for us, as parliamentarians, to give the agency means to help combat terrorism through the exchange of information.

[Rosane Doré Lefebvre, NDP, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Paulson, in this budget, $195 million was cut from the RCMP.

Is the lack of resources as a result of this nearly $200 million budget cut affecting your ability to combat terrorism?

[Commr Bob Paulson]

Thank you for your question.

The answer is no. We've changed our way of managing our activities.

We changed how we prioritize our federal policing model, and consequently we're able to move resources into and out of national security cases to match the tempo and pace. So the cuts have not affected our operations.

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Carmichael, please.

[John Carmichael, Conservative, Don Valley West, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I will direct my questions to you, Mr. Coulombe. You've been getting a bit of a pass this afternoon.

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