Public Safety Committee on March 24th, 2022

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I think that residents of Ottawa still have a lot of questions about their police service and the actions that led up to the declaration of emergency.

We had media reports and we saw pictures of police officers standing by while people were carting jerry cans of diesel fuel. A lot of residents rightfully have questions as to why those officers were not enforcing the law at that time. Can you provide some illumination as to why that did not occur?

[Steve Bell]

Mr. Chair, I'll concur at the beginning that residents of our city did have questions about our activities as we led up to this. I have questions about our activities leading up to this. That's why discussions like these and the internal review that's going to be done by the City of Ottawa are so important. We need to learn from these circumstances. We need to make sure that something like this never replicates itself again.

This was an unprecedented, unseen event for any jurisdiction across Canada. The members of our police service, our unified command team between the RCMP and the OPP, were dealing with a situation that had never been tackled and had never been approached before.

We went through a series of methodical planning, a series of resource gathering, and ultimately utilized the tools that were presented to us in order to safely take down this demonstration and the illegal occupation of our streets. There were as many questions—

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I need to interject. I'm sorry; I have limited time here.

Very quickly from you, on what date did you feel that the protest had moved into an illegal occupation?

[Steve Bell]

As I indicated, as the protest grew in scope and scale, and as we observed the activities of the members, it turned from what would have been a demonstration to an illegal occupation very early in the stage, and that's when we—

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

So it was very early....

There are reports that some members of the Ottawa Police Service donated funds through GiveSendGo to contribute to the illegal occupation. Police officers are necessarily held to a higher standard because of the role they play in our society. What does it say when we have police officers funding an occupation that is actively undermining the residents' right to peace and security and the ability to go about their daily business?

[Steve Bell]

Mr. Chair, that is an extremely important question and one that has been asked of me many times.

I've been very clear around that: People who support, members who support, this activity do not share the values of this organization. We have already commenced and initiated investigations that will look to fully discipline, within our authorities, any misconduct that's identified.

I also think it's really important to balance that. The vast majority of the members of this police service, the members of the OPP and the RCMP and every police member who attended our city, did it with the values that we hold and share to make sure that these illegal activities and occupation of our streets were removed so that the streets could be given back to our citizens.

I think that's the important thing to focus on.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

Thank you very much, Chief.

Thank you, Mr. MacGregor.

We'll now move into the second round of questions. That begins with Mr. Brock, who will have five minutes.

Sir, the floor is yours.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses for your presence today and your testimony.

Largely, my questions will be directed towards Interim Chief Bell.

Interim Chief Bell, as just a little bit of background, we know that there were a number of other similar protests around this country. We know that there was a border dispute in Alberta, a border dispute in Manitoba and a border dispute at the Windsor Ambassador Bridge.

You'll agree with me, Officer, that those disputes were all resolved and removed and charges laid without the invocation of the Emergencies Act. Yes or no?

[Steve Bell]

Mr. Chair, I would debate the definition of “similar”. Border protests in non-residential areas are considerably different from an occupation of what amassed to approximately 20 square blocks in the centre of a major municipality within the country, in front of a Parliament that had to suspend sitting for a period of time so that the police operations could be undertaken. The characterization of the other three demonstrations and where they were situated, as well as scope and scale, I don't think is comparable to what happened within the streets of Ottawa.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

You'd also agree with me, Officer, that in fact part of the wording of the statute is that the invocation can only take place where there are no other existing laws in Canada to remove the nuisance or dispute.

You'd agree with me that in these circumstances there were a myriad of Criminal Code charges, Highway Traffic Act charges and City of Ottawa municipal bylaws, as well as several Superior Court orders, that could have been utilized by the rank and file of the Ottawa Police Service, but there were no charges laid before the invocation of the Emergencies Act.

Do you agree with that, Officer, or not?

[Steve Bell]

I do not, and I do not because there were several criminal charges laid in the course of our enforcement through the process of stabilizing, maintaining and ultimately removing the demonstrators from our streets. The Emergencies Act—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

I'm sorry to interrupt. Was that before or after the invocation of the act?

[Steve Bell]

There were criminal charges laid prior to the invocation of the Emergencies Act.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Okay. What charges were they?

[Steve Bell]

I would—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Were they Criminal Code charges?

[Steve Bell]

Absolutely: There were Criminal Code charges related to activities surrounding the demonstration.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

You mentioned “racing dangerously” around the city core.

Those laws exist under the Highway Traffic Act, and presumably that wasn't simply a report that was generated to the Ottawa Police Service, but your rank and file—hundreds and hundreds of rank-and-file Ottawa Police Service members—were able to witness that dangerous behaviour, and yet no charges were laid in relation to that conduct. You'd agree with me?

[Steve Bell]

As I indicated in my opening, the Emergencies Act was one of the tools that we utilized. What specifically it provided us was the ability to create an exclusionary zone. One of the major issues that we had in trying to manage and maintain was the free flow of people in and out of the demonstration footprint—the red zone, as we called it, and our ability to—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

I get that.

Chief Bell, thank you. I have a limited amount of time. That does not answer my question.

My question is, there were a number of Highway Traffic Act infractions and Criminal Code violations being conducted in the presence of police officers where no charges were laid: What direction did leadership give to the rank and file to turn a blind eye to this illegal behaviour that only became necessary in terms of exercising your duty as a police officer after the invocation of the act?

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

You have 15 seconds, Chief.

[Steve Bell]

There was no direction to disregard criminal activity or the Highway Traffic Act activity. In fact, what we have done is to gather information and intelligence, and we continue to do investigations around that very activity you're discussing.

What was paramount for us was the safety of the community, the safety of our officers and the safety of the demonstrators, and on several occasions that safety was—

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

I'm sorry for interrupting. It's not the best part of my job but it's an important part.

Now we turn to Mr. Naqvi, who has five minutes.

Mr. Naqvi.

[Yasir Naqvi, Liberal, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Thank you to all the officers who are here today.

My questions will be for Interim Chief Bell.

Chief Bell, thank you for being here and for being so forthcoming in answering questions.

I'm going to be asking some really basic fact-based questions, questions that I'm hearing directly from the community I represent. As you know, I represent Ottawa Centre, which was ground zero for this illegal occupation, and I think you've also been asked these questions by the citizens of our community.

Let me start with this: Is it a general practice for Ottawa police to let vehicles park on Wellington Street?

[Steve Bell]

Mr. Chair, as I indicated in an earlier answer, at various times, related to different protests that have occurred in the past, including in the very near past, provisions have been made to allow vehicles into that area, to have protesters' voices heard, after which they have left.