Science and Research Committee on May 5th, 2022

[Valerie Bradford, Liberal, Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON]

Thank you so much, and thanks to all of our excellent witnesses.

I'm particularly happy to see Martin Basiri here with us tonight.

It's good to see you again, Martin, and congratulations on that recent well-deserved win of the Governor General's innovation award. It's so well deserved.

I have a number of questions that I want to ask you, because I think you have some important things that we want to get on the record.

In your experience with connecting students to institutions, how much does program selection play in attracting and retaining academic talent in Canada, and how are organizations like yours assisting in appropriate program selection?

[Martin Basiri]

Program selection is everything, because in different countries there are different job markets. For example, if in the market civil engineering is very hot, maybe in Canada it's not as hot, or in that region it's not hot. Unfortunately, it's not being done properly by the universities, because it's not connected to the labour market.

The good news is that companies like us are trying to fill that gap, trying to send students to the programs that are best suited for them.

The other problem is that a lot of the programs that universities are teaching are not necessarily as relevant to the labour market, or they are very delayed. We need a faster time for universities and colleges, especially colleges, to develop programs. As of now, on average it takes them three years to develop a program. Industry is shifting very fast, so the time for them to get the approval for a new program has to be very short. It has to be under six months for a new technology, for example, blockchain. In three years, the whole industry will change, so if a university takes three years to develop a program, in three years it could be completely outdated.

[Valerie Bradford, Liberal, Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON]

It needs to be nimble.

Do you know what proportion of academic talent who use your service decide to remain in Canada?

[Martin Basiri]

With the data for 2019 that we have, 56% of international students stay here afterwards, but then when you survey them, over 75% said they would like to have stayed here. The difference is probably the ones who either can't stay or they found opportunities in another country.

A lot of people go to the United States, especially in STEM, unfortunately. If you are a good computer science student or engineering student, you will find they are more attractive. It's very easy, even with hard countries like the Middle East or India, to get a U.S. visa while you are in Canada versus directly going to the U.S. We have to do a better job of retaining them. It's not only about attracting them.

[Valerie Bradford, Liberal, Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON]

Is there anything more that could be done to draw more international students here?

[Martin Basiri]

I believe if we can invest a little bit in the—I go back to the software that Immigration uses. One big problem is that it's very unpredictable. For example, with the students who got visas last year, right now those students are not getting visas, or vice versa. That is sending a very bad signal to the student market. For example, IIT in India, the university that we want every single one of those students to be here...if Canada is unpredictable and your friends with this situation last year got a visa, there's no guarantee that you will get a visa. It's not only that, but the visa rates can go completely up and down.

We need to invest better in predictability and have a longer-term strategy rather than just a very short-term strategy. This way we can build a reputation. We can say that this is the requirement for entering and it's the same every year, so our embassies and counsellors around the world can market those as the requirement for entry.

I'm not saying to lower the requirement. I am saying, stay consistent. It can't be like a stock market that goes up and down. It has to be more consistent. We want talent to come to our country, and good talent wants consistency because they want to make a plan.

In our tech companies, if you are a good software developer and you decide to immigrate, of course you want to have a plan. You want to buy a home. You want to have kids. You can't say that this year it takes six months and next year it takes two years. You need predictability and speed.

[Valerie Bradford, Liberal, Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON]

I just got the wave to close it out. I'm going to ask you to submit the answer to this question to the clerk. What are some of the main reasons that international students come to study in Canada? Someone has also asked me if Ms. Laframboise could send an answer to the responses that she referenced about the grad responses, but didn't get to because of time limitations.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kirsty Duncan]

Thank you very much, Ms. Bradford.

Colleagues, this comes to the end of the panel.

You have brought us such interesting information, and you can see the engagement from the committee here. We say thank you for your time and expertise.

We will adjourn the meeting. Thank you to all.